Money to be in a dance performance?

Aisha Azar

New member
Dancer, etc.

I'll just say it....her name is Eman. Both she and Debbie teach classes through the school district's community education program, but she does it just to get people into her studio. She said she hates teaching the community education classes (said when I danced with her in 2004).

I could go on and on about her, but I'll just say that I went toe to toe with her once before a show because a few of us exited the stage improperly. She was threatening to not let us perform at the next show (we did a 5pm and a 7pm show) and I got in a yelling match with her backstage :-D



Dear Tikvah,

Thank you for being up front about who the dancer is. This is one way in which we can improve the situation, by holding peo0le accountable for their actions. Of course, it is also good to know that the situations we are hearing about are an accurate description of behaviors. I get slammed now and then anhd am always glad wehen I get to tell my side of the issue in the face of criticisdm.
Regards,
A'isha
 

Tikvah

New member
I am sorry she got mad at you for something so silly at your first performance Tikvah...That is really terrible. You are completely correct when you say she teaches community education to get students into her studio and make more money off of them. I am glad you are dancing with better instructors also. I can't wait to start my new class. It is like I waited forever to get the courage up to take a class, then this happens with this teacher, knowing she is not teaching correctly, then having to put up with her for 5 weeks and listen to her abuse students verbally. Now I am free and I can learn from someone who wants to teach!

I did the same thing, except I started directly in her studio. I'm glad you're free :)
 

Tikvah

New member
Dear Tikvah,

Thank you for being up front about who the dancer is. This is one way in which we can improve the situation, by holding peo0le accountable for their actions. Of course, it is also good to know that the situations we are hearing about are an accurate description of behaviors. I get slammed now and then anhd am always glad wehen I get to tell my side of the issue in the face of criticisdm.
Regards,
A'isha

I was hesitant to mention her because she can be a prickly one to deal with....but I don't want other people to be hurt emotionally, physically, or financially by her. I don't dance in Duluth anymore, but she has quite a reputation with the rest of the dance community!
 

leila_yu

New member
I have just read this topic and I couldn't believe about the things I read! Kute nurse, I hope that you have already changed your school, because I have never in my life, heard about something more ridiculous!I know that it has been a while since you put this topic, but I just had to put a comment!What a horrible thing to do!!!
 

KuteNurse

New member
Yes I can imagine her being Prickly if she knew...lol But I honestly feel this was the right thing to do. She has hurt more people and it needs to come to an end. I personally did not have anything against her other than her ridiculous charge rates and how she goes about getting students to dance in her studio. But I do genuinely feel bad that so many students have suffered for a great length of time dancing with her troupe.
 

Tikvah

New member
((hugs)) Isn't freedom a wonderful thing?

I hope you can come down to the Cities at some point! We could round up daSage and any others to go to the Med Cruise!
 

KuteNurse

New member
((hugs)) Isn't freedom a wonderful thing?

I hope you can come down to the Cities at some point! We could round up daSage and any others to go to the Med Cruise!


Yup! We have to do that...My son is racing almost every weekend now, so it might not be until the end of the summer...But maybe I can squeeze it in sooner...It would be fun!
 

Aisha Azar

New member
I was hesitant to mention her because she can be a prickly one to deal with....but I don't want other people to be hurt emotionally, physically, or financially by her. I don't dance in Duluth anymore, but she has quite a reputation with the rest of the dance community!



Dear Tikvah,
It does take a good deal of courage to speak out against unfair behaviors when those who are perpetrating them seem to be in positions of power. I salute you!!

Regards,
A'isha
 

Eve Gulnar

New member
I was chatting with another dancer after class last week. She said something that confirmed what I had already heard and had known. The instructor that I have been dancing with, in addition to charging the monthly fee's for dance class, charges her students $150.00 per dance to be in her performances. The student also purchases her costume. In addition, my instructor charges $15 dollars a ticket for the performance. Approximately 600 tickets were sold. She must be making a bundle. Is this common? To charge the student $150.00 per dance to be in a performance on top of all the other expenses he/she is already paying? It sounds insane to me. I am obviously changing instructors for good reasons not including her ridiculous fees. She does not teach proper posture for starters, she is mean to people in class if they are not catching onto a move, she yelled at my friend for something that was inappropriate, she is not organized and she jumps from move to move, without us even learning the move correctly in the first place. These are just a FEW complaints I have against her. I could go on and on....Ohhh! Her partner is an excellent dancer and teacher and she teaches a majority of her classes. She danced in the performance and she was clearly the best dancer there, but my instructor made a big deal about her daughter's dancing and she did not even recognize the other dancer for helping her out with her classes. Unbelieveable!



Here's the truth.......I've been a student at Eman's for almost a year now and we are preparing for this year's RECITAL (not a hired performance like some of the comments I have read believed). Eman does have girls that go on paid preformances but she is Very picky on which she allows girls to go to. (she refuses to send unprepared dancers or let girls dance at parties which may be misunderstood as stripping or risky for the dancer (bachelor parties etc.)). Duluth is a very conservative area that doesn't quite understand what belly dance is.
The actual fee that was referred to is more like $50 for the show, not $150 per dance!! I have danced in many other recitals (ballet) and paying a recital fee plus purchasing costumes for each specific dance is the norm. Yes tickets are sold (the same, again, as any other recital) to family, friends, any one who wants to attend - the students in the show don't have to. The students and especially the instructors get along great (work well together). Everything cost money, if she didn't charge there would be no recital for the students. The cost for a large venue, advertising, programs (I'm sure I could go on) I'm only guessing is expensive. I've been to her show in the past (that's what got me interested in dancing with her) and they are very professionally done with many dancers of all levels, sizes, and ages. There were about 400 or more people watching in the audience.
In the future, I hope postings are based more on facts than mere speculation.
 

Tikvah

New member
Here's the truth.......I've been a student at Eman's for almost a year now and we are preparing for this year's RECITAL (not a hired performance like some of the comments I have read believed). Eman does have girls that go on paid preformances but she is Very picky on which she allows girls to go to. (she refuses to send unprepared dancers or let girls dance at parties which may be misunderstood as stripping or risky for the dancer (bachelor parties etc.)). Duluth is a very conservative area that doesn't quite understand what belly dance is.

The actual fee that was referred to is more like $50 for the show, not $150 per dance!! I have danced in many other recitals (ballet) and paying a recital fee plus purchasing costumes for each specific dance is the norm. Yes tickets are sold (the same, again, as any other recital) to family, friends, any one who wants to attend - the students in the show don't have to. The students and especially the instructors get along great (work well together). Everything cost money, if she didn't charge there would be no recital for the students. The cost for a large venue, advertising, programs (I'm sure I could go on) I'm only guessing is expensive. I've been to her show in the past (that's what got me interested in dancing with her) and they are very professionally done with many dancers of all levels, sizes, and ages. There were about 400 or more people watching in the audience.
In the future, I hope postings are based more on facts than mere speculation.

It's possible that she's changed her tune from when I danced with her four years ago. She did charge per dance ($50 back then...which would have been ok if there were additional rehearsals for the choroegraphy, but there weren't). Having to purchase costumes makes sense, but she would charge an exorbitant amount for girls to rent her costumes. She tried to get me to not perform because of my size (despite the fact that I was the only one that knew her choreography). She encouraged a dance posture that had the butt sticking out and many of her students developed back problems because of it. Eman herself was having back issues for the show that I performed in. The show was never a recital then. Students don't get chastised for not buying enough tickets for a recital.

Like I said, my experiences are from a couple years ago, so knowledge could be out of date. But I did see her at the October community dance show, and I heard her mocking the dancers that performed that night.
 

da Sage

New member
Here's the truth.......I've been a student at Eman's for almost a year now and we are preparing for this year's RECITAL (not a hired performance like some of the comments I have read believed). Eman does have girls that go on paid preformances but she is Very picky on which she allows girls to go to. (she refuses to send unprepared dancers or let girls dance at parties which may be misunderstood as stripping or risky for the dancer (bachelor parties etc.)). Duluth is a very conservative area that doesn't quite understand what belly dance is.
The actual fee that was referred to is more like $50 for the show, not $150 per dance!! I have danced in many other recitals (ballet) and paying a recital fee plus purchasing costumes for each specific dance is the norm. Yes tickets are sold (the same, again, as any other recital) to family, friends, any one who wants to attend - the students in the show don't have to. The students and especially the instructors get along great (work well together). Everything cost money, if she didn't charge there would be no recital for the students. The cost for a large venue, advertising, programs (I'm sure I could go on) I'm only guessing is expensive. I've been to her show in the past (that's what got me interested in dancing with her) and they are very professionally done with many dancers of all levels, sizes, and ages. There were about 400 or more people watching in the audience.
In the future, I hope postings are based more on facts than mere speculation.

Hi Eve. Welcome to the forum. I am sorry that you arrived here to find your teacher under discussion (although that was some time ago; I suspect you found that old thread through a search engine).

I'm very glad to hear that the performance fees are less than "the grapevine" rumored. I do think it is odd that you pay a performance fee AND sell tickets to friends and family...I think it should be one or the other. And if all the $$ is going into the big venue, advertising, and fancy programs, I would think Eman should be satisfied with a smaller venue, word of mouth advertising, and simple, inexpensive-to-print programs, with less cost to the students and their families and friends. Of course, that is just my opinion. Maybe things are different in Duluth, but in the Twin Cities, I've never heard of belly dance students paying to be in their class recital (although audience tickets are sold at moderate prices)!
 

Aniseteph

New member
We are paying to be in our show this year, and tickets are sold to friends and family, though we aren't under any pressure to get out and sell them.

BUT! this is to cover extra classes and preparation for the group dances, which I think is reasonable as our classes are drop-in, and not everyone wants to perform. IMO it's unfair on the non-performing students to devote the main class to polishing a performance they aren't going to be in. Also having paid for extra classes makes sure people are committed to taking part and less likely to drop out at the last minute.

We're certainly not being charged per dance. :shok:
 

KuteNurse

New member
Here's the truth.......I've been a student at Eman's for almost a year now and we are preparing for this year's RECITAL (not a hired performance like some of the comments I have read believed). Eman does have girls that go on paid preformances but she is Very picky on which she allows girls to go to. (she refuses to send unprepared dancers or let girls dance at parties which may be misunderstood as stripping or risky for the dancer (bachelor parties etc.)). Duluth is a very conservative area that doesn't quite understand what belly dance is.
The actual fee that was referred to is more like $50 for the show, not $150 per dance!! I have danced in many other recitals (ballet) and paying a recital fee plus purchasing costumes for each specific dance is the norm. Yes tickets are sold (the same, again, as any other recital) to family, friends, any one who wants to attend - the students in the show don't have to. The students and especially the instructors get along great (work well together). Everything cost money, if she didn't charge there would be no recital for the students. The cost for a large venue, advertising, programs (I'm sure I could go on) I'm only guessing is expensive. I've been to her show in the past (that's what got me interested in dancing with her) and they are very professionally done with many dancers of all levels, sizes, and ages. There were about 400 or more people watching in the audience.
In the future, I hope postings are based more on facts than mere speculation.


Eve,

I have to agree with others have said here. This thread was deeply put away and you deliberately searched it out. I only posted what I was told by other dancers. Perhaps you should double check the price because I was told by two people that they were charged $150.00 per dance they performed. These were more experienced dancers.

I have said nothing about the professionalism of her programs. It is good that she makes sure students are ready to perform. However, she picks them out? One student has the right to dance over another student? I do not believe it is Eman's right to chose if the student wants to perform or not. It is the students. That is called CONTROLING.
 

Kashmir

New member
I have said nothing about the professionalism of her programs. It is good that she makes sure students are ready to perform. However, she picks them out? One student has the right to dance over another student? I do not believe it is Eman's right to chose if the student wants to perform or not. It is the students. That is called CONTROLING.
I have to disagree. A teacher should ensure that not only students are up to performance but the best possible show is presented. Sometimes that will mean saying "no" to a student for a number of reasons eg too many people for an item, student does have (and can't get in time) the correct style/colour of costume, student not ready (in the dance, stage presence, etc), student already has too many other pieces s/he is dancing.

Although it is possible a teacher has biases, it is also possible that a student does not have a realistic view of her own performance ability.
 

KuteNurse

New member
It's possible that she's changed her tune from when I danced with her four years ago. She did charge per dance ($50 back then...which would have been ok if there were additional rehearsals for the choroegraphy, but there weren't). Having to purchase costumes makes sense, but she would charge an exorbitant amount for girls to rent her costumes. She tried to get me to not perform because of my size (despite the fact that I was the only one that knew her choreography). She encouraged a dance posture that had the butt sticking out and many of her students developed back problems because of it. Eman herself was having back issues for the show that I performed in. The show was never a recital then. Students don't get chastised for not buying enough tickets for a recital.

Like I said, my experiences are from a couple years ago, so knowledge could be out of date. But I did see her at the October community dance show, and I heard her mocking the dancers that performed that night.

Mocking students at performances seems to be her style...As I stated in another post...I sat 2-3 rows behind her in a fall perfomance and she and her partner were clearly laughing and putting down dancers.:(
 

Jane

New member
What do people think about charging dancers, pro through student, for stage spots at festivals where tickets are being sold to the public? There aren't musicians but a DJ only.
 

da Sage

New member
What do people think about charging dancers, pro through student, for stage spots at festivals where tickets are being sold to the public? There aren't musicians but a DJ only.

Paying for a dance opportunity is one thing, paying for participation in a whole event where you may also have the opportunity to dance, is another.

I've paid for a weekend-long event where I was part of a performance (not bellydancing, so don't call out the BDP!). My performance group leaders negotiated a deal where I could have ONLY attended my performance at no charge, and not the rest of the event, but what fun is that? I paid for the whole weekend, and thoroughly enjoyed myself.

I probably would not have attended if I hadn't been performing (and I haven't attended the event since). But it was a good experience.

I haven't heard of a festival situation where people pay specifically for performance spots, and they get nothing else with it. Does that really happen? (I'm not talking about competitions, where your entry fee covers judges and prizes)

Now, our local dance guild has a yearly dance show, and you have to be a member to perform. But when you buy your guild membership you also get to go to the Winter party, the Summer picnic, Guild seminars, etc etc for free. I'm sure some people only join the guild so they can perform in the yearly show, but it's not the guild's fault if they don't take advantage of all the other cool stuff their membership includes.

I think dancers should vote with their feet...if fees are ridiculous, they just refuse to pay/participate. If you pay the fees, you can complain later, but remember it was your decision to pay in the first place!
 

Jane

New member
Paying for a dance opportunity is one thing, paying for participation in a whole event where you may also have the opportunity to dance, is another.

I should have been more specific, sorry! I meant at a belly dance festival. Saturday or weekend long w/workshops, vendors, and a performace open to the paying public at the end.
 

KuteNurse

New member
I should have been more specific, sorry! I meant at a belly dance festival. Saturday or weekend long w/workshops, vendors, and a performace open to the paying public at the end.

I can understand paying for workshops. They are classes afterall. I have a performance coming up with my teacher at the end of May. She just asks each student to pay $10 to cover the insurance cost. Tickets will be sold to the audience to pay the coverage of renting the stage. Now I think that is quite reasonable.

I could not imagine paying extra...If that happens, that teacher is in it for making money. If feel quite lucky I have a great teacher who is conscientious of her students expenses.

A student in my other class came from Chicago. She says in Chicago, she paid $300 dollars for her 6-8 weeks of classes. YIKES! I would be broke! But then the cost of living in Chicago is higher also. Higher rent, utilities etc...
 

da Sage

New member
I can understand paying for workshops. They are classes afterall. I have a performance coming up with my teacher at the end of May. She just asks each student to pay $10 to cover the insurance cost. Tickets will be sold to the audience to pay the coverage of renting the stage. Now I think that is quite reasonable.

I could not imagine paying extra...If that happens, that teacher is in it for making money. If feel quite lucky I have a great teacher who is conscientious of her students expenses.

Really? What kind of insurance? Is it for if a student is injured during the performance?
 
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