Zills

[Hexx]

(please forgive me if this has been posted before)

So, I bought myself a set of zills, but I'll be damned if I can make them work.


I learned that I'm supposed to slide them rather than clapping them, but outside of that I'm pretty lost.

I find that when I slide them, I get them tangled or on weird angles when I slide them back.

Can anyone help me, or direct me to some good resources?

 

[Kashmir]

Sometimes you slide sometimes you clap them. Depends on what sound you want. Are you using zils with two holes and very tight elastic? It needs to be almost tight enough to turn your fingers blue when you first start.

1: start slow
2: the pull off is what often defines the sound
3: from the start move with them. if you are playing rlR rlR rlR etc then take a step on each R
4: a little (say 5 minutes) practice every day

Good luck

 

[Farasha Hanem]

Kashmir, since you're here, how beneficial is it to learn the steps to a "zill choreography" before learning the actual zill playing? Our teacher is breaking down the troupe's zill routine for our class, but she's teaching the steps first, before teaching us the zill patterns. We're the beginner/intermediate class, and we've had a bunch of students move up from the beginner's class. A lot of us have not had any zill lessons, and what I know, I've had to pick up on my own from DVD's and from here. Is this really a good way to learn? Umm, that is, the way our teacher is teaching us? :think:

Of course, only a few of us have our own zills.

I'm sorry if I'm a little spacey---I'm tired and want to go to bed, but my son wants a hair cut, and I'm baking brownies.

 

[tjayedances]

Zills can take a long time, I walk in my neighborhood and practice listening to ME music on my ipod (the neighbors are used to the noise, even though dogs bark sometimes) it has taken me 2 years to get the basic tek a tek down really well, now i am working on the beladi rhythm. Good luck and keep practicing.

 

[Moon]

I like the advice here Belly Dance Advice, Tips, How-To's

 

[BigJim]

Zills are great fun.... I found them very awkward at first... the dexterity wasn't there, thinking to much, brain getting in the way of what you were trying to play... frustration.... and then it starts to happen, you start to get the flow and suddenly you are playing along with what you are hearing ... not concentrating on the old RLR anymore... 3 3 7... 373... 4s and 5s and beledi just seem to flow with minimal effort.... keep practising... it's worth it...

 

[Farasha Hanem]

I'm still curious to know what everyone's thoughts are to learning a zill "choreography" before learning the zill pattern, or melody, or whatever, to the song the class is going to be dancing to. I still think we should have had more lessons on actual zilling before trying to learn a choreo, but that may just be my weird thinking. To me, zills aren't a prop, they're a musical instrument, and deserve to be taught as so. Am I wrong in feeling this way? Should I politely ask if our class can have actual zill lessons?

I kinda feel like we might be rushed to "catch up" to the more advanced students in order to be "ready" to perform this season.

Hope I'm not travelling too far off topic with my question. Should I make this it's own topic?

 

[Kashmir]

I'm still curious to know what everyone's thoughts are to learning a zill "choreography" before learning the zill pattern, or melody, or whatever, to the song the class is going to be dancing to. I still think we should have had more lessons on actual zilling before trying to learn a choreo, but that may just be my weird thinking.

I don't think it'd be too much of a problem - if the choreo stands on its own. Trying to learn two new things at once would be a nighmare - each would interfere with the other. That said, personally I'd teach the zils first as you really need to know how to move with them. Adding them in later might be a it like learning a script then learning the accent - what you need to do is get the accent down first and then speak the words.

 

[Aniseteph]

I'm a zill novice. We did a course before Christmas and everyone seemed to be learning differently; even for the exercises with very simple combinations of rhythms some people wanted it all counted out as how many lefts and rights, and some just heard the patterns and copied.

I don't think it'd work for me to learn the zill "choreography" and then fit it to the steps. I prefer to practise the key rhythms and combinations with simple steps or walking, which gets it into my hands' muscle memory, then add the zill patterns to the steps. This way it isn't about learning a step choreography and a zill choreography and doing them together, which is too much info for my brain to process, it's the steps plus playing rhythms to accompany it, if that makes sense.

 

[Farasha Hanem]

I don't think it'd be too much of a problem - if the choreo stands on its own. Trying to learn two new things at once would be a nighmare - each would interfere with the other. That said, personally I'd teach the zils first as you really need to know how to move with them. Adding them in later might be a it like learning a script then learning the accent - what you need to do is get the accent down first and then speak the words.

That's what I was thinking, too. The choreo is fun, and I love the music we're using (wish I knew what it's called ), but I wanted to get the zilling down first.

Ah, well.

I'll post a vid of one of our practices after I cut down what I recorded tonight in more reasonable segments, probably in the YouTube forum.

Thank you for your input! *hugs!*

 

[Hexx]

Thank you, everyone, so much for your tips. I'm going to try to schedule a good amount of practice every day.

Thank you Kashmir for the great breakdown!

Thanks Moon for the link.

tjayedances and BigJim thanks for the inspiration suitable fore a beginner like me!

 

[lylagus]

Resources - I LOVE MIchelle Joyce's Killer Ziller DVD and highly recommend it. I also have used Jamila Salimpour's CD but don't think the book is worth the $ and didn't really help me any. I do like the book but I'm into having complete sets of things. The CD is enough. I think it's available as a download on Suhaila's site. Mary Ellen Donald Mary Ellen Donald Home Page has been highly recommended by people for years. It didn't work for my learning style at all but I know lots of people swear by it. I think Shira might have a review on her site. Mimi Spencer has a wonderful book and CD!!!! It's a different take on things and I have really enjoyed it. I just bought The Dancing Cymbalist by Jenna Woods and when I go through it i'll let you know. It looks good from my flip through.

To improve with zills you must pratice every day. Try to play along with at least 2 songs or so at first and work up to a longer session. Make sure you are MOVING and not sitting or standing still while playing. I go through the basic ballet arms while walking or doing some sort of foot work. Try walking fast (doubletime to the music) or slow (half time or quarter time with the music) while keeping an even pace with your zills.

I did the 20 min zill drill twice a day or so off of Michelle Joyce's DVD and that helped me immensely with my speed and accuracy.
YouTube - How to Become a Killer Ziller - Belly Dance Finger Cymbals

(please forgive me if this has been posted before)

So, I bought myself a set of zills, but I'll be damned if I can make them work.


I learned that I'm supposed to slide them rather than clapping them, but outside of that I'm pretty lost.

I find that when I slide them, I get them tangled or on weird angles when I slide them back.

Can anyone help me, or direct me to some good resources?

 

[Bellydance Oz]

I don't think it'd be too much of a problem - if the choreo stands on its own. Trying to learn two new things at once would be a nighmare - each would interfere with the other. That said, personally I'd teach the zils first

I agree with this. I mean, you can belly dance already, right?

When you're learning a difficult routine, you learn the hardest bit first (the feet) then add the arms. So when you're learning a routine with zills, learn the hardest bit first (zills) then add the feet, then the arms.

 

[Farasha Hanem]

I agree with this. I mean, you can belly dance already,right?

Yes, but I still stink. XD :lol:

Seriously, though, I've been taking classes for 2 1/2 years now. I'm beginning to see some progress, although I still have trouble with such things like layering mayas and figure 8's with a shimmy. I agree that learning the zills will probably be the hardest part, and I wish we'd learned that first. Hopefully my background and training in music will help me in learning the zills. ray:

 

[Amanda (was Aziyade)]

Farasha, usually when I play cymbals I improvise the dance, but when I have done choreographies with cymbals, I prefer to learn each section of the choreography WITH the cymbals. To me it's easier that way because you're learning "chunks" at a time.

When I'm WRITING a choreography, I start with the cymbal track though. I treat cymbals as another voice in the music, and I try to make sure that voice doesn't overpower or act in disharmony with the music. So I write the patterns I hear that I think would work well with the music, then I start writing the dance choreography. I've tried doing the choreography first, but that drove me crazy.