So Confused??? :)

meddevi

New member
My poor overworked brain, trying not to get deeply into semantics at the moment...if I was just to edit it as a stand-alone, I would put:

"Gothic Bellydance is an evolving style of fusion bellydance that has its roots in the 90's, featuring bellydance blended with the aesthetic, music, and attitude of Goth. Goth is a mindset, a subculture, that I have read came from punk culture. Wherever it originated it has a very distinctive feel to it and dark imagery appeals to many of them. The best way to describe Goth is a quote from the Van Helsing movie, "we try to look on the brighter side of death." It is finding beauty in what would normally be considered the more morbid and moribund aspects of life. Gothic bellydance is an expression of this whether performed with a cabaret and/or tribal foundation. It is not about what style you dance in but how you express yourself while dancing. Costuming tends toward black but isn't restricted by it either. It's more about stark contracts and a white goth is something to behold."

Particularly as a professional designer, I don't have an issue with the word style being applied to GBD(see Style | Define Style at Dictionary.com) - I think that describes what it is. It's not just costuming. You can't just put on heavy eyeliner and a black costume to make something Goth. It has to have application of style, augmenting movement and expression - and that takes technique and intellectual consideration. While the Gothic culture is diverse (Romantic, Old School, Cyber, Steampunk, Industrial, etc), there are still very clear guidelines and values for those many elements that take research and careful thinking to apply. Not that everything done in the name of GBD is successful and evident of that process, but that's what I teach and endorse.

On the other side of things, when I consider Tribal Fusion as it is now and how it's developed over the last 5-6 years, there are no set guidelines, it really is such a catch-all. It's supposed to be Tribal + ? = Tribal Fusion. So Tribal + Hip Hop + Ballet + Indian Classical + Jazz + Goth + Whatever. And then are we talking Indigo TF or Urban Tribal or Unmata or Sera Solstice or a mix of all of the above? While that can allow for a lot of creativity, unless there is a clear sign of what is being fused, it's so hard to hold a ruler up to it and define it. And so much of what is being presented right now really isn't being clearly defined/described, it's just the "well, it's Tribal Fusion." Nor does it help that there are so many new teachers on the block who don't have a foundation in either Tribal or the Fusion aspect, and are just teaching that to new students who have no idea really what they're learning, and so it gets watered down and confused even more. It hurts my brain.

And I just rambled on far longer than planned..back to Gothla US work...

I think I might have found it. So if I rewrote my earlier post to:


Goth Bellydance is often associated with Tribal Fusion but is actually not a dance style in and of itself though it has been around since the 90's. Goth is a mindset, a subculture, that I have read came from punk culture. Wherever it originated it has a very distinctive feel to it and Tribal Fusions dark image appeals to many of them. The best way to describe Goth is a quote from the Van Helsing movie, "we try to look on the brighter side of death." It is finding beauty in what would normally be considered the more morbid and moribund aspects of life. Gothic bellydance is an expression of this whether performed in Tribal Fusion or the more cabaret styles; it is not about what style you dance in but how you express yourself while dancing. Costuming tends toward black but isn't restricted by it either. It's more about stark contracts and a white goth is something to behold.​

...would it be correct?
 

Ariadne

Well-known member
"Gothic Bellydance is an evolving style of fusion bellydance that has its roots in the 90's, featuring bellydance blended with the aesthetic, music, and attitude of Goth. Goth is a mindset, a subculture, that I have read came from punk culture. Wherever it originated it has a very distinctive feel to it and dark imagery appeals to many of them. The best way to describe Goth is a quote from the Van Helsing movie, "we try to look on the brighter side of death." It is finding beauty in what would normally be considered the more morbid and moribund aspects of life. Gothic bellydance is an expression of this whether performed with a cabaret and/or tribal foundation. It is not about what style you dance in but how you express yourself while dancing. Costuming tends toward black but isn't restricted by it either. It's more about stark contracts and a white goth is something to behold."
I do like your version much better, thank you for taking the time. :D

You may be rambling but it's making me wish I could come to Gothla. Best of luck with that!
 

lilith71

New member
My poor overworked brain, trying not to get deeply into semantics at the moment...if I was just to edit it as a stand-alone, I would put:

"Gothic Bellydance is an evolving style of fusion bellydance that has its roots in the 90's, featuring bellydance blended with the aesthetic, music, and attitude of Goth. Goth is a mindset, a subculture, that I have read came from punk culture. Wherever it originated it has a very distinctive feel to it and dark imagery appeals to many of them. The best way to describe Goth is a quote from the Van Helsing movie, "we try to look on the brighter side of death." It is finding beauty in what would normally be considered the more morbid and moribund aspects of life. Gothic bellydance is an expression of this whether performed with a cabaret and/or tribal foundation. It is not about what style you dance in but how you express yourself while dancing. Costuming tends toward black but isn't restricted by it either. It's more about stark contracts and a white goth is something to behold."

Particularly as a professional designer, I don't have an issue with the word style being applied to GBD(see Style | Define Style at Dictionary.com) - I think that describes what it is. It's not just costuming. You can't just put on heavy eyeliner and a black costume to make something Goth. It has to have application of style, augmenting movement and expression - and that takes technique and intellectual consideration. While the Gothic culture is diverse (Romantic, Old School, Cyber, Steampunk, Industrial, etc), there are still very clear guidelines and values for those many elements that take research and careful thinking to apply. Not that everything done in the name of GBD is successful and evident of that process, but that's what I teach and endorse.

On the other side of things, when I consider Tribal Fusion as it is now and how it's developed over the last 5-6 years, there are no set guidelines, it really is such a catch-all. It's supposed to be Tribal + ? = Tribal Fusion. So Tribal + Hip Hop + Ballet + Indian Classical + Jazz + Goth + Whatever. And then are we talking Indigo TF or Urban Tribal or Unmata or Sera Solstice or a mix of all of the above? While that can allow for a lot of creativity, unless there is a clear sign of what is being fused, it's so hard to hold a ruler up to it and define it. And so much of what is being presented right now really isn't being clearly defined/described, it's just the "well, it's Tribal Fusion." Nor does it help that there are so many new teachers on the block who don't have a foundation in either Tribal or the Fusion aspect, and are just teaching that to new students who have no idea really what they're learning, and so it gets watered down and confused even more. It hurts my brain.

And I just rambled on far longer than planned..back to Gothla US work...

My goodness! Have you ever considered writing a book on this subject! It would truly be something to sink your teeth into! I currently have been reading the Tribal Bible but think your art form is so unique itself! Maybe I'm rambling, I'm sure, but I'll bet it has crossed your mind! Hmmmm?;)
 

meddevi

New member
My goodness! Have you ever considered writing a book on this subject! It would truly be something to sink your teeth into! I currently have been reading the Tribal Bible but think your art form is so unique itself! Maybe I'm rambling, I'm sure, but I'll bet it has crossed your mind! Hmmmm?;)

Hehe, thanks :) Actually, I had started on one a few years back, and had a major computer failure and lost all of that information, plus photos and artwork. Definitely have had a lot of people ask, just haven't had the time - but perhaps in the future :) For now, I'd be happy just get to the Resource website updated thoroughly.
 

lilith71

New member
Hehe, thanks :) Actually, I had started on one a few years back, and had a major computer failure and lost all of that information, plus photos and artwork. Definitely have had a lot of people ask, just haven't had the time - but perhaps in the future :) For now, I'd be happy just get to the Resource website updated thoroughly.

I've looked this over too. I really liked it! I have a couple questions for you though. What choices in music do you gravitate to ? Do you lean more towards Goth style music or Middle Eastern? Do you mostly choreograph your work or do you improv?
 

meddevi

New member
I've looked this over too. I really liked it! I have a couple questions for you though. What choices in music do you gravitate to ? Do you lean more towards Goth style music or Middle Eastern? Do you mostly choreograph your work or do you improv?

Thanks!

Well, I'm very much a Gemini, so I can be very split-personality when it comes to inspiration, so I would say it's fairly equal - I love using traditional and folkloric music, but I also love Gothic music - and bonus points if the Gothic music incorporates Middle Eastern music (a lot of my favorite bands utilize Middle Eastern instrumentation, time signatures, etc).

For myself, I work mainly improv, choosing "anchors" of key moments and flowing in between. When I work with my students/on projects with others, I tend to choreograph.
 

missanime

New member
Hi :)

Have you also tried surfing on youtube? :) I've found lots, w/lots who incorporate different styles of other dances into their bellydance routines, and found them all so interesting (as well as opening a plethora of choices and likes/dislikes of what you may want to go w/your own bellydance).

As for all these actual names of styles...? Forget it lol - IMO just try out different things for now and then maybe worry about all the silly labels that I think too many get stuck on anyways ;) lol

HAPPY DANCING TO YOU!
 

lilith71

New member
Yeah I've been doing alot of youtube surfing. I've been having alot of fun checking out a ton of different dancers shimmying it up!
 
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