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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aniseteph View Post
    Mega-rep to Chani.


    Well yes insofar as a movement will look different on a gym-toned flat tum than something jucier, but to me that is totally missing the point of belly dance. Tell it to Fifi - the heart and soul of belly dance isn't about anatomy.

    If someone is unhappy about their body and want surgery then that's fine (although I was expecting something more, er, dramatic in the "before" on that dancer clip to be honest - had a bit of a WTF? moment).

    This is a great place to ask other dancers if they've had something done and how it affected their dancing. It might have been an interesting angle hearing from a surgeon and seeing before and afters on a skilled dancer, but now this just feels like peddling to me, especially since I looked at the website. . It feels like someone exploiting the belly dancer angle to get his name out there some more. It's all making me queasy now.

    I couldn't find a clip of a dancer talking about how surgery affected her dancing but here did you really mean the title to read "Video Expenses Tummy Tuck Surgery for Belly Dancer"?
    No I did not, that was a typo. That is the problem of writing the pages myself and not having a proof reader. Thank you very much - now corrected. Sometimes posting in forums like this bring the advantage of such issues that I can quickly fix.

    Here is the Video of Experiences of Tummy Tuck Surgery on Belly Dancing. I split that off since the total for that patient was about 30 minutes, way to long to keep as one video.

    My being on this forum is just like my participation on Klinefelter Syndrome forums, Gynecomastia Forums and other issues I have a passion for: Public Education. It has been such efforts over the years that won me awards from my peers.

    Michael Bermant, M.D.

  2. #22
    V.I.P. da Sage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    Actually, my joining this forum was for public education and to share experiences of those who used surgery to restore elements that they were not happy with.
    I personally don't mind that you joined to point us toward your documentation. Such pointers would be on-topic to this thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    For the years I have been looking at belly dancing videos, I have yet to see one of such design.
    So you're a fan of belly dance? Please tell us more about your favorite videos - I for one am quite curious. What are your favorite videos? Who are your favorite dancers?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    The fact is that Sumo wrestlers do not have a long life expectancy and seeing someone of that body build performing a belly dance might be something like Disney's hippos performing ballet in his cartoons.


    This sort of judgment is NOT on-topic or appreciated in this forum.

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    To me it makes little sense to bash someone trying to help with posting answers based on extended experience, posting real examples and real experiences and documentation.

    Hope this helps,

    Michael Bermant, M.D.
    You might be helpful if you would share your examples and documentation without your rude and mocking exposition. Or, if it's too much trouble for you to be polite while posting, consider logging out and gracing some other forum with the *highly questionable* value of your company, so that we don't have tire our fingers by scrolling past your posts.
    Last edited by da Sage; 08-31-2010 at 04:00 AM. Reason: Per moderator's request, per Michael's complaint about a certain descriptive noun that rhymes with bowl

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by da Sage View Post
    I personally don't mind that you joined to point us toward your documentation. Such pointers would be on-topic to this thread.



    So you're a fan of belly dance? Please tell us more about your favorite videos - I for one am quite curious. What are your favorite videos? Who are your favorite dancers?
    Here are some of the belly dancing links I have collected over the years that I have used to study the motion of the abdominal muscles in my quest to improve my surgical sculpture. They are not in any particular order. My real favorites are my own patient's videos that I do not have permission to share.

    ‪Tara Star Belly Dance Drum Solo‬
    YouTube - Tara Star Belly Dance Drum Solo

    Rachel Brice Drum Solo
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keN17yEUIDo

    belly dancing
    YouTube - belly dancing

    Amira belly dancing to Short Belly Dance Drum Solo by Raquy
    YouTube - Amira belly dancing to Short Belly Dance Drum Solo by Raquy

    Tribal Drum Solo
    YouTube - Tribal Drum Solo

    Art of Belly Dance: Drum Dance Demonstration
    YouTube - Art of Belly Dance: Drum Dance Demonstration

    Badia Bellydance Turkish drum solo
    YouTube - Badia Bellydance Turkish drum solo

    Izzy's Impish Encore
    YouTube - Izzy's Impish Encore

    Sadie BellyDance
    YouTube - Sadie BellyDance

    belly dancing
    YouTube - belly dancing

    Jamil Male Belly dancer
    YouTube - Jamil Male Belly dancer

    Turkish Belly Dance - Elçin
    YouTube - Turkish Belly Dance - Elçin

    Tribal Dream ( Belly Dance )
    YouTube - Tribal Dream ( Belly Dance )

    ‪bellydance supersar!‬
    YouTube - bellydance supersar!

    Rachel Brice performs at Tribal Fest 6
    YouTube - Rachel Brice performs at Tribal Fest 6

    Rachel Brice - Drum solo
    YouTube - Rachel Brice - Drum solo

    BellyDance Superstars - Bellywood
    YouTube - BellyDance Superstars - Bellywood

    Ansuya!
    YouTube - Ansuya!

    Groupe drum solo
    YouTube - Groupe drum solo

    Akon - Bananza (Belly Dancer)
    YouTube - Akon - Bananza (Belly Dancer)

    TURKISH MALE BELLY DANCER DiVA
    YouTube - TURKISH MALE BELLY DANCER DiVA

    Rachel Brice Tribal Fusion Bellydance
    YouTube - Rachel Brice Tribal Fusion Bellydance

    Rachel Brice paris performance 2005
    YouTube - Rachel Brice paris performance 2005

    Hope this helps,

    Michael Bermant, MD
    Learn More About Tummy Tuck Abdominoplasty Surgery
    Last edited by DrBermant; 08-30-2010 at 11:58 AM.

  4. #24
    Moderator Shanazel's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    There is no question that bouncing flesh has its own artistry. To each their own. The fact is that Sumo wrestlers do not have a long life expectancy and seeing someone of that body build performing a belly dance might be something like Disney's hippos performing ballet in his cartoons. And yet there are those who claim that to be fat is natural, and beautiful. Yet others that claim that any clothing covering the body is unnatural. For those individuals, I do not criticize their choices nor their preferences.
    What obnoxious comments, sir. Do you expect criticism of belly dancers with "bouncing flesh" to go unremarked because it is tacit and accompanied by disclaimers?

    To help dancers regain and/or maintain abdominal flexibility after surgery is an admirable thing; I wish such therapy had been available for me and am happy that you make it available to dancers now.

    To emphasize the importance of firm unmoving abdominal flesh to the art of belly dance is the mark of a narrow education and a narrow definition of beauty, though naturally I do not critisize your choices or preferences.

    You may an expert on plastic surgery, but many of us are experts on belly dance. He who would educate dancers must first be educated about dancers, hmmm? Allow me, please, to introduce you to some of my favorite dancers of assorted sizes and abdominal firmness since your list is a little heavy (no pun intended, but I like it) on Rachel Brice:

    Fifi, with an untucked tummy and marvelous jiggle:
    YouTube - FIFI ABDOU at Mena House.Cairo-86. Part 2.#!

    Maria Aya, also untucked and marvelous
    YouTube - Maria Aya, Belgrade 2009

    YouTube - Oriental Soul Kids - Maria Aya Greece

    Claudia, beautiful and oh- is that her untucked tummy I see?
    YouTube - Claudia Belly Dance - SARC Benefit - Portland Oregon

    Chelsea, who'd probably not have been allowed to dance Clara in the winter ballet but who rocks as a tribal belly dance/reggae fusion performer
    YouTube - Chelsea performs @ Tribal Fest 6

    Tito, to represent my favorite unsculpted male dancers
    YouTube - Tito - Helwa Sabah - ????

    And, of course, Salome, your hostess, a perfect example of American Oriental
    YouTube - Belly dancer Salome
    Last edited by Shanazel; 08-30-2010 at 07:10 AM.
    "Well, now that we have seen each other," said the unicorn " if you'll believe in me, I'll believe in you."

  5. #25
    V.I.P. lizaj's Avatar
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    Rep rep Shan baby...
    I am afraid one has to search further to find real belly dancers.

    Rachel Brice is hardly a good example of a belly dancer as she doesn't usually belly-dance. She's a beautiful woman and marvellous dancer but she ain't Camelia.

  6. #26
    V.I.P. lizaj's Avatar
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    May I also add at this point that I am fully aware that many real belly dancers have made use of cosmetic surgeons particularly with face lifts and boob jobs. That's their choice and their way of trying to remain commercial and marketable. A superstar dancer trying to extend her career, that I fully understand. I think it's a shame but we all like to take short cuts and to hold off the inevitable if we can.
    What I would hate to see is a number of young hopefuls who might go under the knife in the chances of getting a career say with the BDSS or ageing semi-pros who might think plastic will give them a chance.
    Obviously with an inceasing number of cosmetic surgeons on the scene they are looking for new territories to exploit and that will include people for whom these processes are completely unecessary.

  7. #27
    Premium Member Aniseteph's Avatar
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    This thread was making me nauseous but I had to look in again didn't I?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    The fact is that Sumo wrestlers do not have a long life expectancy and seeing someone of that body build performing a belly dance might be something like Disney's hippos performing ballet in his cartoons. .
    Pardon? How rude is that? Yeah, it's all just one big joke, let's laugh at the fat belly dancers, ha ha ha...

    Rep to Shanazel, you said what I think (only more politely, as ever).

  8. #28
    V.I.P. Greek Bonfire's Avatar
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    I'm not a doctor but as long as they don't cut any muscle I would think you could go right back to dancing without any problems.

  9. #29
    V.I.P. da Sage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    Here are some of the belly dancing links I have collected over the years that I have used to study the motion of the abdominal muscles in my quest to improve my surgical sculpture. They are not in any particular order. My real favorites are my own patient's videos that I do not have permission to share.

    ‪Tara Star Belly Dance Drum Solo‬
    YouTube - Tara Star Belly Dance Drum Solo
    The quality of this video is so bad, I'm surprised you could learn anything from it.

    Quote Originally Posted by DrBermant View Post
    Akon - Bananza (Belly Dancer)
    YouTube - Akon - Bananza (Belly Dancer)
    If you hadn't lost me at the "Disney hippo" comment, you would have lost me right there.

    I call bull$hit. You've been studying bellydance videos for years to help improve your surgical abilities? But now it's Youtube videos (Youtube hasn't been around all that long). And your favorite videos are of your patient...how conveeeeenient.

    It's a shame this forum doesn't have an ignore function.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by da Sage View Post
    The quality of this video is so bad, I'm surprised you could learn anything from it.


    If you hadn't lost me at the "Disney hippo" comment, you would have lost me right there.

    I call bull$hit. You've been studying bellydance videos for years to help improve your surgical abilities? But now it's Youtube videos (Youtube hasn't been around all that long). And your favorite videos are of your patient...how conveeeeenient.

    It's a shame this forum doesn't have an ignore function.
    My YouTube book marks were at 4 years, 3 years, 2 and 1 years. At 4 years was the first time I can document that search for belly dancing when I first learned how to actually bookmark the videos on YouTube. However, I have been studying the body in motion for decades, not just with belly dancing. But my video documentation of my own patients has stimulated me to continue to grow and improve with my techniques of surgical sculpture and documentation of recovery.

    Each to his / her own.

    Michael Bermant, M.D.

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