Dance and Tourism

[Habibi L'amour]

Hey guys,
I did a Tourism class in school which ended in receiving a Certificate II; and I remember one video saying that tourism can either water-down/alter cultural things such as dance or benefit them. Which do you think tourism has done for belly dancing? Or, what do you think belly dancing has done for tourism?

 

[Shanazel]

In the heart of tourist-infested Wyoming... nothing.

 

[Greek Bonfire]

It amazes me how all over the world when there is a world event, the dance of the USA is always portrayed as square dancing when that is such a small percentage of the national dances. For instances, salsa was originally created in New York and jazz also came from the USA, but they never show this. As far as bellydancing goes, I think we already know that in most places around the world, it is still misrepresented as a hoochy coochy dance or bad dance done mostly by loose women.

 

[Lydia]

Habibi.....you said what has dance done for tourism? wel in the country where i live it has done a lot ....Dubai was a little tiny place where people lived in the desert and small arabic houses mailny ...when i got here in 1984 it was still like that ..they started to build new streets and buildings but it was just a ,,start,, now everybody knows ,,dubai,, in those days not many people knew even where was Dubai...and i was performing in all the big hotels there was 7 those days in the city of dubai...hilton, 2 sheraton,s ,intercontinental,meriedien ,and holiday inns....dubai was living from trading with other gulfstate,s and india,untill the oil was found....but i remember that when Dubai started to promote tourism in magazins and on foreign tv,i was always part of the program and always in the tourist magazins my pictures were in it....in one magazin a german tourist magazin (i still have it) i will try to copy the page...on the front cover are shown differant middle eastern country,s and a picture that present that country....you would see for example the pyramids under egypt and a picture from petra on jordan...the UAE hade my picture!! i was very proud ofcourse,but now i think it was perhaps to show people how open minded this middle eastern country this is and bellydancing is cool??? and the tourist could come here and dance and have a good time ....so i think in this country bellydancing was defently a asset to promote tourism....

 

[Habibi L'amour]

That's great Lydia! What are you doing now? Yes Dubai does sound like one of the most open minded countries in the middle east, I want to visit there someday when I can afford it.

 

[shiradotnet]

Which do you think tourism has done for belly dancing? Or, what do you think belly dancing has done for tourism?

Hi there! Have you seen the book Pyramids and Nightclubs by LL Wynn? The entire book examines the phenomenon of tourism in Egypt, including the different categories of tourists that have gone there over the years.

Tourism has provided a MAJOR benefit to belly dancing in Egypt. That's because the tourists from the Persian Gulf (Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, etc.) who came to Egypt in the 1970's and 1980's spent a LOT of money in the 5-star nightclubs enjoying the dancers. Because of these Gulf Arab tourists, there was a lot of money to fund the careers of dancers such as Nagwa Fouad, Nadia Hamdi, and Soheir Zaki. The Gulf Arabs were the primary audiences for these dancers - most Egyptians couldn't afford to go to those clubs, and Euro/American tourists didn't go there in large enough numbers to make much financial difference to those nightclubs.

In the past decade, the Gulf tourists have become less interested in going to see belly dancing in the Egyptian clubs. The younger generation of Gulf Arabs would rather do other things, such as go dancing themselves in discos. Belly dancing is viewed by many in the younger generation as old-fashioned. And for that reason, many of the old 5-star nightclubs have closed. As a result, there are very few places to see top-quality belly dancing in Cairo these days.

 

[Habibi L'amour]

Maybe things are starting or will start to turn around:
Row over 3 new belly dance channels in Egypt - The Egyptian Gazette

Belly Dancing TV takes off in Egypt | English | SOCIETY | DayPress

The el-Teet channel also has a facebook page, but I have to use Google Translate to get an idea of what it's saying.
I guess now it's the western tourists who are supporting belly dancing because of how popular it is now.....I hear of tours for dancers in Egypt and Turkey being available now (my school's sister school runs one every two years, but it's expensive).

 

[shiradotnet]

I guess now it's the western tourists who are supporting belly dancing because of how popular it is now.....I hear of tours for dancers in Egypt and Turkey being available now (my school's sister school runs one every two years, but it's expensive).

It's true that the big dance festivals have created a new type of tourist format in Egypt - nowadays, it seems as though every time you turn around there's a dance festival.

It's hard to know whether these festivals will continue, now that the revolution has happened and a new government dominated by an Islamist party has won the majority. We'll just have to wait and see what happens.

The ongoing news of violence in Tahrir Square is NOT good news for Egypt's tourism industry. People see those clashes on television and incorrectly assume the whole country is erupting in violence. They don't realize that the bulk of the protests and associated violence are confined to one fairly small area. There are many stable, peaceful parts of the country that can offer a fabulous experience.

It reminds me of some years ago when a European coworker told me he was afraid to come to California for a business conference, because of "all the violence against tourists that's going on". I had no idea what he was talking about, so I asked. The violence he was referring to was in Florida, 3,000 miles away.

 

[Shanazel]

Some time back there was a member who based all her knowledge of US culture on soap operas and that talk show guy who always had the crazies on his show. I want to say Jerry Falwell, but he's a preacher... Is there a Jerry Springer? Anyway, nothing anyone said convinced her that we weren't all a lot of godless over-sexed drug addicts who slept with their in-laws. It was on TV, wasn't it? And TV shows are an accurate reflection of national attitude and mores, right?

 

[Habibi L'amour]

I think the talk show guy IS Jerry Springer, he and his guests are always crazy. It's amazing how TV can affect people's attitudes towards an entire country......just as the media can make your favourite style of dance more popular, it can also make your country look absolutely terrible. Once when I was in New Zealand, I met an English family and when I told them I live in Australia and the mother was like "Don't you have so many dangerous animals running around everywhere?". While it is true that we have many poisonous and otherwise dangerous animals here, they're mostly in the north and rural areas - I guess a general rule could be that the further south you go, the safer you are from our less friendly wildlife. And the cities are safe too.

 

[SeeJaneDance]

I can't speak for other areas, but I live in a region of the US that relies very heavily on the tourism industry. Without it, the local economy would go bust. That said, a lot of people have a very extreme view or vision of what southern Louisiana is like, and some regions get a little caricaturish in their attempts to live up to that vision. That doesn't mean that the dancing and the music aren't still Zydeco, or that the food isn't spectacular, but it can get a little larger than life, and some areas can be very insular, to avoid changing. I think in that respect, belly dance has been a great addition to our area, because it encourages something different that's still very rich and fits in, to one extent or another, to the culture here. And as it grows here, the local studios are able to host events and workshops, which promotes local tourism, which will hopefully continue to grow. I know that the growth of it here also encourages students and hobbyists and the local performers to travel elsewhere to visit and learn from other dancers. Now what our travel does to those other places, I don't know, but I do know that the travel is started, in the first place, by the enthusiasm for the dance that's fostered here. Does that make sense?

 

[Farasha Hanem]

Some people in more metropolitan areas who have never been to the Midwest STILL have the idea that people in my home state of Oklahoma ride around in covered wagons, all the guys are cowboys, and that Native Americans live in teepees. Oo;;; THANK you, Hollywood. -_-

Oh, and some people are quite surprised when they hear that Oklahoma has bellydancers!

 

[shiradotnet]

Some people in more metropolitan areas who have never been to the Midwest STILL have the idea that people in my home state of Oklahoma ride around in covered wagons, all the guys are cowboys, and that Native Americans live in teepees. Oo;;; THANK you, Hollywood. -_-

Oh, and some people are quite surprised when they hear that Oklahoma has bellydancers!

My stereotype of Oklahoma involves tornadoes!

 

[Tarik Sultan]

Maybe things are starting or will start to turn around:
Row over 3 new belly dance channels in Egypt - The Egyptian Gazette

Belly Dancing TV takes off in Egypt | English | SOCIETY | DayPress

The el-Teet channel also has a facebook page, but I have to use Google Translate to get an idea of what it's saying.
I guess now it's the western tourists who are supporting belly dancing because of how popular it is now.....I hear of tours for dancers in Egypt and Turkey being available now (my school's sister school runs one every two years, but it's expensive).

I think that the festivals have helped individual careers to an extent because they allow people who have either retired or don't get the opportunity to perform much an avenue to make a name for themselves. Many have used them as a springboard to get onto the international seminar circuit and of course the promters themselves turn a profit.

However, I'm not sure if festivals alone can be sufficient to hold up the institution the same way the Gulf Tourists did back in the day. There just aren't enough of us to keep night clubs open and pay musicians etc.

It will probably still continue but on a much smaller scale and much smaller venues like the dinner boats, but all this depends on the number of tourists, which depends on the political climate. Right or wrong, a lot of people are scared to travel there now and its the general public, not the dance community that is needed in large enough numbers to keep them going on a daily basis. If dancers don't have enough work to make a living they will move on to something else and you wont have people getting into the profession.

Things seemed to have been going well for dance in Sharem because they received tourists not only from the Arab countries and Europe, but local Egyptians as well. In comparison to the Cairo nightclubs, the venues I saw in Sharem, Alf Layla and Old Market, were relatively inexpencive and family friendly. The quality of dancing..... hit and miss. Some really good some..... weeeell.....

I think the T.V chanells are successful because people want entertainment, distraction from the daily grind. Whether it will continue or is just a fad, who knows. I think in some form it is a fad, just like talk shows were in here in the States in the 90's. There wash a rash of them all of a sudden, then one by one they died off leaving a few standing. I think the same will happen for most of these chanells. The good thing is they offer the general public a way to see dancers who would never be able to fork over 2 or 300 pounds to see a show live.

 

[Habibi L'amour]

Where exactly is Sharem? But of course not all of the dancers would be excellent, it's the same in every profession. If Sharem is good for belly dancing then maybe I will visit there, I'm not too interested in Cairo because that's where most of the violence is and I hear it's very polluted (I don't want my asthma to come back after over ten years of being cured of it).
Yes some people in the first article I posted said they liked the distraction from the "daily grind". But there was also a university student who likes the channels for the dancing and a high school girl who said the channels are a good project for preserving the dance, which she said "had not been given it's rightful due".

 

[Pirika Repun]

Sharm El Sheikh and Na'ama Bay are located at Sainai Peninsula where many male dancers perform there. Tito used to perform at Alf Layla I believe. Because of male dancers (except folkloric dancers) can't perform Oriental dance in Cairo, most male dancers perform at Sharm and Na'ama Bay. I think Miro, Ali and Hatem (aka Tommy King) also perform there. Miro and Ali are pretty good what I saw on YouTube. Miro teaches at Ahlan Wa Sahalan, and Hatem teaches at Nile Group.

 

[Lydia]

That's great Lydia! What are you doing now? Yes Dubai does sound like one of the most open minded countries in the middle east, I want to visit there someday when I can afford it.

Habibi...i stopped performing 2 years ago...now i teach in Dubai and do workshops outside from Dubai...i did more then 5000 shows and was thinking ,,i geuss its enough now ,,lol i am very lucky because i was alwyas worried that the day comes when i will stop to dance,but i dance now everyday in class ,and you know what its cooool!!!!!!! ...because i get to talk to people every day ,i missed that when i was performing i run from 1 place to another everyday never hade time for friends or family ,always traveling ...i loved it ,loved the job ...but very lonely...so now i feel great still dance every day and have time for friends and family!!

 

[Greek Bonfire]

Some people in more metropolitan areas who have never been to the Midwest STILL have the idea that people in my home state of Oklahoma ride around in covered wagons, all the guys are cowboys, and that Native Americans live in teepees. Oo;;; THANK you, Hollywood. -_-

Oh, and some people are quite surprised when they hear that Oklahoma has bellydancers!

LOL - some people still think there are Al Capone shootouts in the streets here! Sadly, there is gang warfare here but that's another topic.

 

[Tarik Sultan]

Where exactly is Sharem? But of course not all of the dancers would be excellent, it's the same in every profession. If Sharem is good for belly dancing then maybe I will visit there, I'm not too interested in Cairo because that's where most of the violence is and I hear it's very polluted (I don't want my asthma to come back after over ten years of being cured of it).
Yes some people in the first article I posted said they liked the distraction from the "daily grind". But there was also a university student who likes the channels for the dancing and a high school girl who said the channels are a good project for preserving the dance, which she said "had not been given it's rightful due".

With the exception of the male dancers, the big names like Randa, Soraya, Dina only perform in Cairo. If I were going to go to Egypt to see dance, I'd do Cairo first, see all the big names, then do a few days in Sharem. Maybe you'll get lucky and see some good female dancers. Then I would either go to Luxor, for the tranquility and the sights or I'd do the Nile cruise. Relaxing, very beautiful, CLEAN AIR!

I never doubted that there are people in Egypt who care about the dance as an art. Its just that there are not enough of them to keep it going. Even Broadway is dependent mostly on tourism to keep all those shows going. We New Yorkers are proud of our theater tradition, but most of us have never seen a show, nor do we have the money to buy expensive tickets. If we do, it might be a one a year thing at the most.

It would be nice if they could develope a family friendly alternative to the nightclubs for dance. Make it part of a larger folkloric show. There's a lot that could be done to improve the reputation and distance it from the unsavory elements found in the clubs. The places I went to in Sharem did this, its just that the level of skill wasn't spectaculr. Also, as much as I love a nice bedla I think a change of costume would be a good way of combatting the objections of those who complain that the costuming is immodest. Make it more modest, more elegant etc. Wouldn't hurt. Besides, the costume hasn't had a makeover since 1920 or '30 something.

What I think is there needs to variety. Those who want something more modest should have it, those who want the clubs should have it, male dancers should be allowed to perform in Cairo as well so those who want to see that could have it too. Everybody gets to have whatever flavor ice cream they prefer:dance:

 

[jjj]

@ SeeJaneDance: Hey, I'm not too far from you. I love Lafayette, especially their food.

@ Farasha Hanem: I've visited OK a couple of times and I can tell you it has the friendlies people ever. I love to go antique shopping there too.