Isolating upper abs from lower abs?

Sirène

New member
I was working with the Bellydance Superstars-Killer Drillz with Zoe Jakes DVD and hit a little bump: in the pre-drill "belly" section, she talks about working the upper & lower abs independantly, without involving the chest & hips, using instead a series of push and pulls. Of course Zoe makes it look as simple as opening and closing your eyes, however, when I try to do the movement I find it impossible to keep the upper and lower abs separate. She recommends sitting or laying down to help isolate the muscles, but that doesn't seem to help my control.

Any ideas how to work towards being able to do the drill? A part of me says, just keep trying, but if I can't isolate the muscles am I accomplishing anything?

(Does anyone else have this dvd?)
 

Darshiva

Moderator
draw in your diaphram for the upper abs. draw in just above your pubic bone for lower abs. It's not precise but it will help get you thinking in the right regions.
 

Kashmir

New member
Lie on your back. Knees bent. Place one hand above the belly button and one below. Push your one hand in then push against it (your abs will go in then push out) - while keeping the muscles under the other hand relaxed. Repeat a few times then change hands.
 

Sirène

New member
draw in your diaphram for the upper abs. draw in just above your pubic bone for lower abs. It's not precise but it will help get you thinking in the right regions.

Hi Darshiva


I am able to pull in both groups. What I can't seem to do properly is pull in one group while leaving the other neutral, or as Zoe instructs, pushed out. Actually, consciously pushing out my upper abs is downright impossible.


ETA:

Lie on your back. Knees bent. Place one hand above the belly button and one below. Push your one hand in then push against it (your abs will go in then push out) - while keeping the muscles under the other hand relaxed. Repeat a few times then change hands.

This is my issue. I can't seem to keep the "other" group relaxed. I feel like there is an echo in the muscles I don't mean to engage, and pushing out the upper abs without getting the back and chest involved seems impossible. I'm beginning to wonder if I'm misunderstanding the directions...
 
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Kashmir

New member
This is my issue. I can't seem to keep the "other" group relaxed. I feel like there is an echo in the muscles I don't mean to engage, and pushing out the upper abs without getting the back and chest involved seems impossible. I'm beginning to wonder if I'm misunderstanding the directions...
Like anything else it is just practice. Relax. Take it slow. If need be start with just the pull in - you can use your hand for feedback - ie you only move under the hand. Relax. Just start with small movements.

If you tend to be a chest breather you diaphragm may be very out of condition. Maybe just working on pushing out your abdomen when you breathe in and pulling it in when you breathe out might be needed for a while. However, do not use you breath to activate your abs - this is just to become aware of your diaphragm and get it a bit stronger and under conscious control.
 

Solissa

New member
I'm experiencing exactly the same trouble, Sirene. Hope we get it soon. :)
I agree that trying it while very relaxed helps. Don't plan to work on it...but sometime, when it comes to mind randomly, just try it. I discovered that I do awesome shimmies first thing in the morning, just because my body is so relaxed. ;) It is harder with ab isolations, though...it doesn't seem like something you can do while relaxed, you know? I guess it's a sort of balance like everything else...Haven't found the balance yet though.
 

Ahava_Melantha

New member
What I used to do is this:

first grab one hand and stretch to the side, then the other side and wiggle it until your ribs are lifted.

Now put your hand in the horizontal center of your belly near your belly button. Push your stomach out above your hands, then belly your hands then all of it. thats How I practised.

hope it helps.
 

Yame

New member
I don't mind practicing, what I mind is that it doesn't seem to get any easier. :lol:

I think you're too hard on yourself. You actually can isolate your upper abs from your lower abs. You just need to make that isolation stronger and to develop the control to do it more easily, when you want it, how you want it.

I still haven't seen Zoe's DVD so I don't know how she does or explains the exercise, but I'd recommend placing one hand on your upper ab, one hand on the lower ab, and feeling what you are doing.

Because in the beginning, you can't necessarily see or feel in your body whether or not you are using the right muscles, but if you use your hands you are better able to feel what your belly is doing and whether or not your upper abs and lower abs are moving independently of one another.

Don't get worried or stuck on the fact that when you engage the upper abs you are also engaging the lower abs and vice versa. Just keep working towards that goal of isolating them, and slowly you will find that you will be able to engage one "piece" without fully engaging the other. And slowly again you will be able to engage one "piece" without the other at all.
 

Manuela

New member
One hint that helped me a lot was to actually bend over with the hands on my knees, so that the belly hangs down. It looks terrible of course :lol: ...but for some reason, that is the position in which I "feel" the muscles most.

On the other hand, I still find it totally impossible to bellyroll while lying down - I think that's the most difficult position, so I'm not sure you'd want to start that way. But maybe you're different :)

And of course it helps to strengthen your abs! There are great exercises to strengthen upper and lower abs separately - so that helps isolating them too.
 

Ahava_Melantha

New member
another thing that helps is that if you've lost muscle conrol of your abs, when you practise the isolations, poke your belly with your finger it can help bring back muscle awareness and control. sounds weird but it helps.
 
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