male bders are NOT gay!

Ahava_Melantha

New member
okay, I have this issue with male belly dancing.

my hubby can't stand it. and everyone that I know of thinks all males who belly dance are gay! but from what I know of, that isn't true. zorba has a wife and I think Tito is too. I believe I have read an article once about male belly dancers in Egypt.

does it frusterate anyone else this stupid myth that is around? because it isn't true. It really gets on my nerves.
 

gisela

Super Moderator
It is stupid. I know someone who insists that Horacio is gay even though he's been married to lovely Beata for years and years. She says it must be a phony marriage and that he really is gay. I've tried to talk her out of it because it's just so ridiculous but she won't budge. I guess male balletdancers have this myth as well.
Some dancers are gay yes, but some are not. Just like anywhere and anything, and who cares really. It's not like it's the worst label one can get either :lol:
Anyway, we are dancers, not just a sexual preference.
 

Kashmir

New member
If he could see how often male belly dancers hit on female ones - he'd change his mind!

There was a radio interview recently with a male dancer (ballroom I think). He recalls how all the boys at school would rag him. One day he pointed out while they were out in the cold with their heads between some guy's sweaty legs [playing rugby], he was gently pressing a young girl's breasts to his chest.
 

khanjar

New member
With many male dancers cannot win, because even if a male dancer is married they can still be gay according to the vociferous and that because somewhere they heard of someone who was, it is always the same, you can't change the minds of the rigid.

But, the way I see it, it is up to the women to quash this mentality by letting males know they want male belly dancers and it is not a statement of their lack of masculinity, that is if they do.
 

Yame

New member
I see two issues with the problem your husband is having accepting male belly dancers.

The first problem is of course, that the assumption that all male belly dancers (or all male dancers in general) must be gay is completely false. Although I do believe there is a higher proportion of gay men in many solo dance forms than out in the general public (I have no idea what the actual statistics are), I also know many straight men who are dancers and belly dancers. Sure, one could argue that some of these "straight men" are actually closeted homosexuals (and yes, guys, it happens, marriage is not proof of sexuality), but not all of them. "Straight man" and "belly dancer" are not mutually exclusive.

Like others, I also find it strange that moving one's body to music, even if done with a female partner, is considered gay and feminine but wrestling with another sweaty man on the ground is considered straight and manly.

The other problem is... does he have a problem with men being gay? Some people are gay... some people are straight... some people are bi and anywhere in between. Why is someone else's sexuality any of his business, and why does it bother him? Even if all male dancers were gay (hypothetically), who cares?

I mean, I can TOTALLY understand that for a non-dancer straight male, it's more pleasing to watch an attractive (to him) female dancer than a male dancer, so I can see men being indifferent to watching other men dance, but not to be disturbed by it...
 

Aniseteph

New member
khanjar said:
But, the way I see it, it is up to the women to quash this mentality by letting males know they want male belly dancers and it is not a statement of their lack of masculinity, that is if they do.

Why is it up to us to do anything? We DO appreciate male dancers - there was even that thread recently about whether it's tough following a male dancer when too much fuss is made by a predominantly female audience. And the big names over here have a very appreciative following. I think there is quite a bit of wanting going on in Tito's audiences. And artistic appreciation of course, plenty of that too. ;)

If you mean not wanted in terms of welcoming into classes; well on a list of reasons for why a teacher might not want a male dancer in a class, "because he's probably gay" is crazier than most. So if he isn't that's OK? Who wants their sexuality to be an issue in class?

I don't think women's appreciation of men dancing is enough to overcome some men's fears of what people will think. Otherwise partner dance classes would be awash with spare male partners looking to impress the ladeez.

As for male dancers being gay or not - oh good grief, who cares?
 

Zorba

"The Veiled Male"
As for male dancers being gay or not - oh good grief, who cares?
Thank you!!

When I'm asked (or accused) "the question" - I always respond "Yes, many male Belly Dancers *are* gay; maybe even the majority - so what, who cares?"

As a straight guy, I have observed that (in general) gay guys are MUCH more secure in themselves, and tend to be much easier to be around due to their lack of "chest pounding". They're more civilized, are better educated, and have an evolved sense of esthetics.

I think a lot of straight guys are insecure in themselves because they're not *sure* about themselves - the gay guys *know* what they are...

Your psychobabble for the day...
 

Shanazel

Moderator
Why anyone gives a rip about the sexual preferences of anyone they themselves are not intimately involved with (or with whom they intend to become intimately involved) is beyond me.

Too gay, too fat, too skinny, too tall, too dark, too light, no boobs, no waist, heavy thighs, stick ankles, thick hair, thin hair, no hair, WHO CARES? If everyone would just shut up and dance the world would be a happier place.
 

khanjar

New member
The way I look at it and I may be looking at it wrongly, is the more male belly dancers there become the less pressure will be on women when following male dancers as and/and male dancers will be seen as less of a novelty and there be judged by their artistic interpretation not their rarity or perhaps even if it is still assumed they are gay, the stupid irrelevant question won't come up that often, which is a start in the right direction.

But do women want males dancing, well I like to see women dancing, so I assume women would like the opposite, if women like to see the complimentary gender and want them up there with themselves, get educating, but often it is with couples as we have seen on a forum elsewhere recently love is stronger than drinking buddies down the pub.

But gay as a word also means happy, so someone, anyone can be gay and not homosexual, reclaim the word and be happy and with time the confusion it creates will make it lose it's meaning. And then can anyone be bothered to create a new term to use as a questioning derogative.
 

khanjar

New member
Thank you!!

When I'm asked (or accused) "the question" - I always respond "Yes, many male Belly Dancers *are* gay; maybe even the majority - so what, who cares?"

As a straight guy, I have observed that (in general) gay guys are MUCH more secure in themselves, and tend to be much easier to be around due to their lack of "chest pounding". They're more civilized, are better educated, and have an evolved sense of esthetics.

I think a lot of straight guys are insecure in themselves because they're not *sure* about themselves - the gay guys *know* what they are...

Your psychobabble for the day...


A lot of gay men, I perceive as more balanced, often confident, gender neutral maybe and not the threat many men make them out to be, because for someone to feel threatened just what does that say about them.

Yes, I agree, many men are very insecure.
 

shiradotnet

Well-known member
I think one reason SOME audience members feel uncomfortable with watching male dancers is that they believe the old incorrect stereotype about belly dance originating for the purpose of seducing the sultan, and therefore they see EVERY belly dance performance through that belief system. They then have difficulty determining how to fit a male performer into this stereotype. Assuming him to be gay enables them to keep their stereotypes.
 

Lara

New member
shira, I think that can be part of it, but there is also the contingent that has a hard time seeing any man on stage at all (say nothing of dance, or further of belly dance!)
There *are* a fair number of gay men in theater, and they tend to be more visibly "out" than mainstream society has been.

I think the confidence thing is part of it. Historically, I think that's partly because it was one of the safe places where it was somewhat expected (I won't say accepted, necessarily!) since stage work was "unclean" in it's own right, if you will. but I also think that if you are confident enough to come out about *any* taboo subject in a given society, what's a little stage fright? Conversely, if you're willing to bare your soul on a stage, would you be more likely to be comfortable being true to who you feel you are?

Not all dancers/theater people are gay, not all gays are theater people. Who cares, I want to see some good dancing. State it as fact (because it is) and let the other person deal with it. It's not really up for debate.
 

Ahava_Melantha

New member
the only real problem I have ever seen with male belly dancers was one local male belly dancer whose mother was a belly dancer and he grew up belly dancing since he was a kid. He was in fact gay. but the problem arose when he would flirt with men in front of a man's wife and children, in a very obvious, and out there way.

but other than that, I hate it when male belly dance, even tito, is gay. not that there aren't some of them, just another bd pet peeve of mine I guess
 

Duvet

Member
okay, I have this issue with male belly dancing.

my hubby can't stand it. and everyone that I know of thinks all males who belly dance are gay! but from what I know of, that isn't true. zorba has a wife and I think Tito is too. I believe I have read an article once about male belly dancers in Egypt.

does it frusterate anyone else this stupid myth that is around? because it isn't true. It really gets on my nerves.

Not all male bellydancers are gay. Not all female bellydancers are straight. The assumption annoys me (I hate being taken for granted), but the fact either way doesn't matter. Am I enjoying the dancing is all I really care about.
 

Pirika Repun

New member
First of all I don't care anybody's sexuality. If the person is good dancer, he or she is good dancer, and who cars about their sexuality?

Oriental/Belly dance is NOT our culture, but in Egypt its THEIR culture. If you go to Egypt or even go to Egyptian night club, both men, and women move their hips and dance, because this dance IS their culture, and their dance. So we have to respect other culture, and can't judge them by using Western standard for other culture (any culture). However, like Shira said some stereotype of Harem girl seduced sultan and "IMAGE" of the dance make Oriental dance is for only women and if men do it, then people think he might be a gay.

Egyptian dance is "Social dance" and men, women and children dance the same way as we see from professional dancers. However, they do in home or social setting not all of them become professional dancer, but still enjoy at home. Why not many guys become professional Oriental/Belly dancer? (there is many folkloric dancers) I assume that one reason is religion, and other is "Image" or Belly dance. Also even in Cairo, male dancer can't perform Oriental dance (raqs sharki) but only folkloric dance without shake their hips which I heard (except international dance festival such as Nile Group and Ahlan Wa Sahalan) , but in Sharm el Shiek they can perform Oriental, and therefor all male dancers (include Tito) perform there.

Here is Tito's interview about being professional male Oriental/Belly dancer in Egypt. Now he wears tight costume, but (I assume that) not in Egypt (except for Nile Group festival).
Now there is more professional male dancers in Egypt. Like he said if he can dance and he loves dance, why not to become professional dancer?



BTW, Tito has three kids (2 girls and 1 boy) and his son is sooooo cute and he has the same smile as Tito! :D Tito loves kids. ;)
 

khanjar

New member
Blast it, the video Pirika linked says ;

The Uploader has not made the video available in your country

Why, what have they got to hide ?
 

SidraK

New member
Not all male bellydancers are gay. Not all female bellydancers are straight.

I think these stereotypes play into one another in an interesting way. Dance, in our society, is often coded as something done by women and bellydance, even more so, is seen by the GP as something done by women for men. So not only do we get a stereotype that male dancers must be gay, there's also a prevailing assumption that a female dancer must be straight. Because ultimately, it's not about us and it's not about the love of dance. It's about the guys (and only the guys, dontcha know?) in the audience.
 

Amulya

Moderator
I think the idea of dance in western society only being for females is rather new, men used to dance in folkloric dances and in pairs with women (was still popular in the 50's and 60's, then ballroom dancing went out). It's just that in the last decades it has become unpopular for men to dance.
 
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