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  1. #21
    V.I.P. Kashmir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EsmereldaDancer1987 View Post
    I didn't realise this belly dance forum would be so bitchy and judgemental! I asked for some advice not to be picked at, i dont even think i was as bad as you are all making me out to be considering ive basically taught myself how to dance.
    If you had posted that video and said "this is what I've taught myself so far - what do you think?" You probably would have got praise for your clean technique and dedication but still pointed to needing some lessons in how to belly dance (as opposed to moving your body). But you didn't come as an amateur hobbist - you came asking whether you were professional standard and the answer was a resounding "no".
    Quote Originally Posted by EsmereldaDancer1987 View Post
    Im not going to give up on my passion for belly dancing as im so drawn to it. I did not expect these kind of comments. I actually thought the belly dance community would be more enlightened as it is supposed to be a spiritual dance created by the Ancient Egyptians.
    Well, there is part of the problem. You are drawn to "belly dance" but basically don't know what it is. I've spent a lot of time in research and there is no evidence for it being "a spiritual dance created by the Ancient Egyptians". No evidence that it is even the same dance as depicted on the tomb paintings (have you studied Lexová's "Ancient Egyptian Dances"?). You want to see the closest thing the roots of belly dance? There's that beledi dancing that you had never heard of and was so dismissive of.
    Quote Originally Posted by EsmereldaDancer1987 View Post
    Dancing is meant to be a celebration of a woman's body, all these little things that people pick at to make sure its perfect rips the soul out of it. The Ancient Egyptians didn't do all that they just danced and moved their bodies to the beat of the drum for rituals, celebrations and also preparing women for birth etc.
    Actually it isn't. For a start men and children belly dance too. Belly dance is a celebration of your community and the music. Your body (if you are a woman) is what you use to communicate with. The dance isn't all about you.
    Quote Originally Posted by EsmereldaDancer1987 View Post
    I honestly thought the belly dance community would be a lot more nicer, Belly dance is my passion, dancing is my passion as ive loved it since i was a little girl and im going to keep at it every day and do it the way my intuition tells me, ill let that guide me from now on.
    Right - and dance with your intuition as much as you like. Enjoy it. Just don't call it "belly dance" and don't think you are ready to be paid to belly dance in public.

  2. #22
    V.I.P. Yame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EsmereldaDancer1987 View Post

    constructive criticism is welcomed but what people tend to forget on forums is that unless people can back up their opinions with a video of them performing themselves to the standard they're being critical of then it's all just hot air with no substance, a good critique comes with a good counter example or demonstration from the critic in my opinion.
    I probably shouldn't reply to this because at this point it's pretty obvious you're most likely just a troll, but I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt for now...

    You DO realize that YOU came here posting your video and asking if we think you are ready to be a professional, right? That's an invitation for criticism. If you didn't want your dance to be critiqued, why did you ask?

    If you don't care for the opinion of dancers you have never seen and whose dancing you may not like, why ask here? Why not book private lessons with the dancers you do like, or send them an email?

    Most of the responses here have been very constructive and helpful. Sure, some of it may have come off a little harsh, but most people were trying to help you and answer your questions. We don't owe you any credentials, because YOU asked US. We didn't go barging into your youtube channel giving you our opinions, unasked.

    So ask yourself, why did you come here asking for opinions and advice, only to tell people off after hearing what they had to say, even though no one was disrespectful or rude to you? Did you just come here for validation? Did you expect to be showered with praises? Because if that's the case, you're in for a surprise. The world doesn't owe you praise and validation. If you work hard and try to actually learn about the dance you claim to be doing though, you might start to earn some respect and admiration. But it takes dedication, time, and patience. It also takes thick skin and the ability to take criticism (especially criticism that you ASKED for). The latter which you clearly, for now, do not have.

  3. #23
    V.I.P. Aziyade's Avatar
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    Oh Yame, you know us: we're all just jealous haters who don't understand her art.

  4. #24
    Member MizzNaaa's Avatar
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    You know...I've never actually EVER been offended by anything anybody said about our dance, until this thread.

    “It looks like a drunk woman trying her best not to fall over”
    Erm...excuse me? If 'baladi' looks like a drunk woman trying her best not to fall over, why the heck are you bellydancing exactly? Since you do realize baladi IS bellydance, it just happens to be what we call it here in Egypt.

    I'm not even going to start quoting any of the rest of the utter nonsense you just wrote in that post because not only are you misinformed, you're being stubborn about your ignorance as well. NO, Bellydance isn't a celebration of a woman's body or femininity or what-have-you, baladi (or what you'd call bellydance) is a social dance, men women and children dance it here and if you've taken about...I don't know, 10 minutes to do a little google search about what Bellydance is you would have known much more than the nonsense you're typing up right now. There is no evidence that Ancient Egyptian dance is what you call bellydance, and the only origin of bellydance AKA Oriental dance is OUR cultural social dance which is baladi. I'd like to also inform you that - NEWS FLASH - the moves you were making in that video mostly are from baladi or are a modified version of baladi...so yeah.

    You didn't come here for constructive criticism, you came here to get validated and told that you're great. You presented yourself as someone who'd want to be judged as a professional so don't come crying when we give you what you asked for.

    I believe everybody else pretty much summed up my reaction very well.

  5. #25
    V.I.P. Ariadne's Avatar
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    ..."a drunk woman trying her best not to fall over” artistically.



    So when are we going to get that flounce emoticon?

  6. #26
    Moderator Darshiva's Avatar
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    I feel sorry for the OP. It's really hard having your delusions of grandure ripped out like a rug from beneath you. I've been there.

    About 4 years into my dance training I thought I was all that, ready to teach, best dancer in the world bar Rachel, and so on. So I ordered Keti's A-Z original with the intention of nailing it & submitting my coursework in the shortest time ever and doing teacher training in the same - by correspondance - to be completed within 6 weeks - three months at the most because I was just that damned good. And when I received the package, I popped in the dvd and started... to get very embarassed by the realisation that I wasn't all that hot after all, this was a lot harder than I thought it was going to be and I was struggling with the most basic concepts on the dvd.

    Well I've been dancing for 9 years now and teaching for 4 and I still haven't finished that dvd. But among the amazing lessons I learned from it was the lesson of humility. I'm not all that. I will never be. Even if I achieve international stardom as a dancer there will still always be room for improvement.

    And sadly, that's a lesson I doubt the op really wants to learn. Because having the ability to realise that you're not as good as you think you are and that knowing that is a good thing takes a level of humility I don't think she posesses. But then again, I could have said the same thing about myself 5-6 years ago, so who knows. Maybe she'll go away & think about it & realise that insulting bellydance is not the way to win the adulation of bellydancers. And that she has a lot to learn about dancing before she decides to take it out in public.
    Bellydance in Kyabram!
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  7. #27
    V.I.P. Jane's Avatar
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    Treat people seeking advice with caution. Most of the time they are really seeking validation. Really not worth bothering. <shrugs>

    Serious students pay for professional opinions in private lessons.

    This thread belongs on SockPuppet Theater http://sockpuppettheatre.com/ We need a belly dance version.
    Last edited by Jane; 01-16-2013 at 06:53 AM.

  8. #28
    Junior Member EsmereldaDancer1987's Avatar
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    My god its like being on a forum with bitchy school girls, i see one of you has disliked my video that just shows how petty you really are. Theres me thinking the belly dance community would be more supportive. I didn't expect to be praised i was looking for genuine advice, not to be bashed and picked at on what im doing.

    There are different styles of belly dance im more interested in Raqs Sharqi than Raqs Balady. Dina was the belly dancer i was referring to when i said she looks like a drunk woman, the others you sent me i liked.

    But seriously can we stop with this bitching i really cannot be arsed with it as it just doesn't resonate with me, i like the keep the peace.

    This is what i see more as the ancient dance of Egypt

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5BwgCeZ--w

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1u5WJ-G_bbs
    Last edited by EsmereldaDancer1987; 01-16-2013 at 09:03 AM.

  9. #29
    Moderator Darshiva's Avatar
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    Serena is known for being as experimental as her husband. Both are very big names in bellydance, but only Hossam is Egyptian.

    If this is the style that interests you, look for an instructor in your area who teaches Suhaila Salimpour method. That way you can work on your musicality and transitioning in a style that actually interests you.

    As far as bitchiness goes, I'm afraid that started with your derogatory comments about authentic bellydance. I wouldn't assume that someone from OD put a negative mark on your video, from what I could tell everyone was trying to encourage you to keep going with the dancing without encouraging you to make the mistake of public performance well before you were ready. And as far as that goes, the majority of the commenters speak from experience there. You do not want to go into public performance right now, I know this from how negatively you have been taking constructive peer critique.
    Bellydance in Kyabram!
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  10. #30
    Member M'Lady Caija's Avatar
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    It's all about the point of view and with wich attitude you read what others say...

    Noone is out to get you, but you reacted pretty harsh yourself.

    If you have trouble with criticism at this point, you're not ready, coz if you go on stage at a restaurant and then get critisism from the owner you'll probably won't take that as well either. And that might cost you your spot as an entertainer as well as it can damage your reputation in that city, coz restaurant owners do talk to eachother about the dancers they hire...

    But in the end, it's up to you, either you take the critisism and advice from here to practice and work more on your dance or you go on stage and risk getting the boot.

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