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  1. #11
    V.I.P. Kashmir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    Anetta, back there, in the native home of belly dancing, in the Levant, or the MENAT region if that's what you prefer, shakin it is what they do ...

    With not only da men watching, but also da women and da kids, both boys & girls ... Nobody makes any apologies about it ... It is just, par for da course ... LOL
    Yes, in the home of belly dance they do "shake it" - men, women and kids. Only non-professionals tend to shake it in single sex groups. Female civilians dance with women and kids, men dance whenever they feel like - but they don't tend to party with "nice" women. Clubs might be expanding this for a small percentage of young people - but it is not the norm (at least in Egypt).

    Women who dance in front of (non-related) men are professionals. Professional dancers - or professional prostitutes. Egypt has quite strict rules for professional dancers - the acceptable ones. Big names can get away with stuff - but a dancer showing her crutch and belly and fondling herself would not get a licence to become a big name. Rather this looks more like a cabaret performance - unlicenced. I'm quite surprised with the wedding as well. I have been in good restaurant when a licenced belly dancer appeared - appropriately dressed - and a man took his two children by the hand and removed them until she had gone.

    So, can she dance? Yes. Is it belly dance - yes but on the beledi end of the scale (nothing wrong with that I prefer beledi to Orientale myself). Is it likely she will make a real name for herself? Probably not - and the first video would possibly be a reason for her to be turned down (morals and costume).

  2. #12
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    Really ... That's interesting ... Was just thinking, if she was to be marked down, it wud be more for the second vid, costume too tight, gyrations a bit on the over-provocative side (for want of a better term) etc.

    I thought the first vid of her was the more decent one ... Clad in casual leather jacket & pants. Well, she took her jacket off midway thru her dance, but so does Salman Khan ... As for the whatchacallit, stitching of hand caricature, on her bum, I thought that was more for a laugh & a lark - something to be taken in harmless good fun - rather than an invitation to someone to make a lusty grab for her bottom.

    Although, once ya get into a good clubby mood, one cud easily do that & get away scott free, even be rewarded with a flirtatious smile if ya do it with proper form ... Sounds like someone is talking from personal experience, eh

    Naah, just kidding ...
    Last edited by DreamHunter; 05-21-2015 at 01:05 PM.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farasha Hanem View Post
    If you're a newbie to bellydance, then where did you get this information? Do you personally know many bellydancers? Have you worked professionally with any bellydancers? Did you look up this golden nugget of information on the Internet? Have you personally seen a bellydancer's resume? Or is this something you've just assumed?

    To "clarify the boundaries," although there are some dancers out there who do perform other forms of dance besides bellydance, such as pole dancing and burlesque, this is not something that is standardized. Not all bellydancers perform both bellydance and "adult-oriented" dance genres (by the way, "Oriental dance" is not considered to belong to the latter. Oriental dance is good old Raqs Sharqui, which is the basis for bellydance).
    Yes, Uncle Google and Mr. YouTube are the most wonderful teachers & instructors. Why not.

    No, I did not know that 'oriental dance' is 'Raqs Sharqi' until your post above. And becos I'm still not so well versed in these things, I should steer clear of visually enjoying belly dancing as an art form? No, I don't think so.

    And to be completely honest, I'm still trying to get my head around the true, full meaning of Raqs Sharqi, although I hv a vague idea of it, from reading the Arabic script on many dance vids, and whether correct or otherwise, as one form of belly dancing.

    For me, by my layman's understanding, 'oriental dancing' cud hv meant anything from Asia, especially, but not necessarily limited to, the easternmost parts of Asia. But now, especially in the context of dancing, it's increasingly looking like I'm going to need to expand this perception. Quite substantially too.

    You might hv a different understanding of 'exotic dancing' & 'oriental dancing', but not me. Not right now, not yet, although I'm just beginning to sense a subtle difference. Well, maybe it's a major difference, I don't know this yet. But for me, up to this point in time, I've been somehow inclined to consider that the terms 'exotic' & 'oriental' are, on their own, to be specific, in many ways closely related, especially if one is thinking from a western-based context.
    Last edited by DreamHunter; 05-21-2015 at 02:01 PM.

  4. #14
    V.I.P. Kashmir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    I thought the first vid of her was the more decent one ... Clad in casual leather jacket & pants.
    If you ever do get to Egypt, unless you stick to the strictly tourist areas, I would recommend not wearing clothes that so clearly show your crutch. Respectable people (both sexes) cover from chest to mid-thigh. Skin tight pants are asking for trouble.

    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    Although, once ya get into a good clubby mood, one cud easily do that & get away scott free, even be rewarded with a flirtatious smile if ya do it with proper form ... Sounds like someone is talking from personal experience, eh
    Sure, in the US (maybe). Not in Egypt.

  5. #15
    V.I.P. Kashmir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    Yes, Uncle Google and Mr. YouTube are the most wonderful teachers & instructors. Why not.
    Because the internet is full of "incorrect information" (I'd say something else in person!) posted by people who know little or nothing. There is no peer review process. Anyone can say anything. Just because 1000 people (each quoting each other) all say the same thing does not make it true. Wishing doesn't make it true either.

    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    And to be completely honest, I'm still trying to get my head around the true, full meaning of Raqs Sharqi, although I hv a vague idea of it, from reading the Arabic script on many dance vids, and whether correct or otherwise, as one form of belly dancing.
    Raqs Sharqi is public entertainment belly dance - as opposed to what is done by ordinary people with friends (of the same sex).

    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    For me, by my layman's understanding, 'oriental dancing' cud hv meant anything from Asia, especially, but not necessarily limited to, the easternmost parts of Asia. But now, especially in the context of dancing, it's increasingly looking like I'm going to need to expand this perception. Quite substantially too.
    "Oriental Dance" is English for the French danse orientale - which is what professional "belly dancers" call what they do in Egypt (and elsewhere I imagine). It can mean any belly dance in general (here I'm assuming the speaker does actually know what belly dance is) or belly dance to a specific type of sophisticated and layered music - tending to be long with many rhythmic and style changes. Sometimes referred to as Orientale with a small or capital o.

    Raqs sharqi is the Arabic for danse orientale.

    Quote Originally Posted by DreamHunter View Post
    You might hv a different understanding of 'exotic dancing' & 'oriental dancing', but not me. Not right now, not yet, although I'm just beginning to sense a subtle difference. Well, maybe it's a major difference, I don't know this yet. But for me, up to this point in time, I've been somehow inclined to consider that the terms 'exotic' & 'oriental' are, on their own, to be specific, in many ways closely related, especially if one is thinking from a western-based context.
    Well, if you are really here to learn, you might see the difference. In a nutshell, 'exotic dancing' is about sex (and also orientalist imperialism - "our" women are pure, those other women are hanging out for it - look at how they shake it); 'oriental dance' is the professional version of a folk dance from MENA - which is perfectly respectable and danced my men, women, and children to this day.

  6. #16
    Moderator Shanazel's Avatar
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    Where is the "banging the head against the wall" emoticon?
    "Well, now that we have seen each other," said the unicorn " if you'll believe in me, I'll believe in you."

  7. #17
    Moderator Farasha Hanem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shanazel View Post
    Where is the "banging the head against the wall" emoticon?

  8. #18
    Moderator Shanazel's Avatar
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    Thank you.
    "Well, now that we have seen each other," said the unicorn " if you'll believe in me, I'll believe in you."

  9. #19
    Moderator Farasha Hanem's Avatar
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    You're welcome! xD

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kashmir View Post
    In a nutshell, 'exotic dancing' is about sex (and also orientalist imperialism - "our" women are pure, those other women are hanging out for it - look at how they shake it); 'oriental dance' is the professional version of a folk dance from MENA - which is perfectly respectable and danced my men, women, and children to this day.
    So, 'exotic dancing' is mainly about sex, then ... I see ... Well, they might as well hv called it 'sexually oriented dancing' then, for all it's worth ... And avoid all the confusion among unsuspecting newbies like us ...

    Perhaps they just want to retain the 'exotic' branding, for marketing purposes, like ... And maybe 'sexually oriented dancing' might not sell as good as 'exotic dancing' ... And on top of that, its acronym wud hv been SOD ... Something not so conducive for the marketing department to do their work ...

    Oh, sod it ...
    Last edited by DreamHunter; 05-25-2015 at 12:54 AM.

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