Back bends question...

[Ravenhairedbellydancer]

Hi, i was wondering about those scary back bends lol( they scare me). I once read that back bends were only to be done one you had established strong back muscles and beginners should not try them,,, is this a movement that takes years of training to learn?

 

[Moon]

I think it can be learned faster, (although I can't do them, but I'm also not practicing them) if you practice a lot. However, it is extremely important to do a good warm up and have a good posture when trying this move, otherwise you can injure your lower back. It is good to include a forward bend after you practiced a backbend (though not during a performance ofcourse ).
Your back muscles need to be strong, but your upper leg muscles too!

 

[Zahrah]

I agree - warm up and stance are key though they won't protect you if you're not strong enough in the first place.

 

[Q-Tip]

I learned to do backbends in reverse.

• I started on the floor on my back.
• Bring your heels up to your butt - knees bent.
• Put your hands on the floor just above your shoulders and next to your head with palms down.
• Slowly raise your body until you are in the backbend position.
• Hold the position for a specific amount of time (the length of time depends on your progress).
• Return return your body to the floor slowly.
• Repeat this a few times every day.

**You absolutely must do a good warm up before doing this**
You don't want to take the chance of injuring your back by being in a hurry.

I used to hold the position for the length of 1 TV commercial. After a short while I was ready to do a 'real backbend' because my body had learned the position.

I used to stand with my back to the wall, I would reach behind me and walk my hands down the wall. Of course you have to move your feet out the farther down the wall your hands get.

I also learned the splits by doing a few every day and holding the position (as far as I could comfortably go) for the length of a tv commercial.



Sadly I can do none of these things now because I haven't practiced in Y E A R S!!!

 

[janaki]

Backbends need strength in thigh muscles. As Moon said it good warm up is very important. Regular streching is very important. I am ok with my backbend, somedays I am good somedays I am not, it all depends how ny arthtitis is behaving@@

 

[Kashmir]

Hi, i was wondering about those scary back bends lol( they scare me). I once read that back bends were only to be done one you had established strong back muscles and beginners should not try them,,, is this a movement that takes years of training to learn?

The strength also needs to be in your abs and thighs.

A "good" backbend should also be spread over the whole spine. Too many that you see looks like someone being bent in half - ie one sharp bend. You need to get a little from each joint. So, you also need flexibility. This not only takes time, it also is dependent on your body make up.

 

[adiemus]

I was just going to chime in with 'you really really really need to have strong abdominals!!!!' when Kashmir did it for me! Analysing the movement, you do need strong quads, abdominals, glutes, and paravertebrals along the length of your spine. You also need good knees to get up and down from the position. Your neck needs to be able to support itself against gravity - so perhaps not one for me, I think!

 

[SaraKat]

You might want to investigate doing some crosstraining in yoga to develop the strength and flexibility necessary to execute a proper backbend. It's best if you can consult a reputable yoga instructor for help developing a pose sequence (and to make sure you are doing the poses correctly).
Here are some to try...

You might want to start with Locust Pose Yoga Journal - Locust Pose

Once you feel comfortable with that these are options as well - make sure to also do some forward-bending counterposes too
Cobra Pose Yoga Journal - Cobra Pose
Bridge Pose Yoga Journal - Bridge Pose
Bow Pose Yoga Journal - Bow Pose
Fish Pose Yoga Journal - Fish Pose
Camel Pose Yoga Journal - Camel Pose

And once you feel comfortable with those, you can try Upward Bow (Wheel) Pose Yoga Journal - Upward Bow or Wheel Pose (this is like Q-Tip's suggestion above)

When I was little in acrobatics class I learned to go into Wheel Pose from standing, and I can still do it now (thanks Mom for sending me to dance classes all those years!) but it took me a few years of yoga and strength training to develop the muscles to be able to comfortably hold a backbend. I have always had the flexibility, but that is NOT ENOUGH. :naghty: Just because you can contort your body into a pose does NOT mean that pose cannot hurt you. Do NOT rush headfirst into stunts like backbends and Turkish drops or else you run the risk of seriously screwing up your back. I know dancers who have given themselves severe sciatica from doing backbends with no training.
Done properly, all that yoga I linked to is very good for your back, but done incorrectly it can also hurt you. Please be careful.

 

[rita1969]

I can do a backbend on the floor,but not standing up yet.

I can do a backbend on my knees,but cant do it standing up yet,but im
practing it.

 

[Mara2]

Hi, i was wondering about those scary back bends lol( they scare me). I once read that back bends were only to be done one you had established strong back muscles and beginners should not try them,,, is this a movement that takes years of training to learn?

As the other posters have mentioned, you really need strong abs. I have my students do a specialized leg lift to help build their abs. You need a director's high chair (ideal), or the end of your bed will suffice in a pinch. Sit on the very edge of the chair/bed, lean back on your forearms, and extend your legs until your toes are barely touching the floor. Lift both legs together slowly until the bottoms of your feet face the ceiling, then lower them slowly. Work up to 20 of these, and your abs *should* be strong enough. When you start doing backbends, do them on the floor or your bed on your knees. If you *fall* it doesn't hurt his way. When you feel confident, you can do them standing using a bar in the studio, or a counter top to hold on to with one hand. Make sure whatever you are holding is secure, and use mats underneath you or lots of pillows. At first you will push your pelvis forward, as your body's center of gravity is just below your naval. You want to try to put that center between your feet (which should be well apart with the feet turned out), if that makes sense? It helps with the balance. Once you're very good with these your center will come naturally, you won't have to think about it, and won't need your feet so far apart. Hope some of this is helpful.

 

[Amanda (was Aziyade)]

A "good" backbend should also be spread over the whole spine. Too many that you see looks like someone being bent in half - ie one sharp bend. You need to get a little from each joint. So, you also need flexibility. This not only takes time, it also is dependent on your body make up.

I was taught backbends from the upper spine first -- like in ballet, or Flamenco. I've seen a lot of weirdness in backbends lately, and I think it's because they're just bending from the lower spine. I can't help but think this is horribly bad for you.

 

[RioDancerCO]

When you're doing a slow backbend that ends by laying on your back with your knees bent (slow and controlled transition) how on earth do you transition your feet? Logically, I know that my feet must have to rotate a bit otherwise I end up with my toes folded under which makes for akward ugliness for the rest of the move and sore toes! I keep wondering if I need to be shifting my weight or if it's just because the floor is too 'sticky'...

 

[Mara2]

When you're doing a slow backbend that ends by laying on your back with your knees bent (slow and controlled transition) how on earth do you transition your feet? Logically, I know that my feet must have to rotate a bit otherwise I end up with my toes folded under which makes for akward ugliness for the rest of the move and sore toes! I keep wondering if I need to be shifting my weight or if it's just because the floor is too 'sticky'...

You always keep the backs of your feet on the floor, never bending the toes. Otherwise you can break a toe, damage your foot, hurt your ankle, etc. There's no transition, you start with the backs of the feet on the floor.

An easy way to get down on the floor...standing with feet hip-width apart, lean forward slightly on (say) your left leg. Your weight should be mainly on your left thigh. Slightly lift your right leg and slide your right foot, back of foot on the floor with toes slightly curled towards bottom of foot, back with knee bent until you are on your right knee. Then shift your weight to your right thigh and slide your left foot back with the back of foot on the floor, again, toes slightly curled towards the bottom of your foot. There are many ways to get on the floor, but this one is easiest, and safest to describe online. Hope this helps.

 

[Mara2]

When you're doing a slow backbend that ends by laying on your back with your knees bent (slow and controlled transition) how on earth do you transition your feet? Logically, I know that my feet must have to rotate a bit otherwise I end up with my toes folded under which makes for akward ugliness for the rest of the move and sore toes! I keep wondering if I need to be shifting my weight or if it's just because the floor is too 'sticky'...

I'm such a dork...I just reread your post. You are asking about transitioning from a standing to a kneeling backbend. Your feet should be positioned with heels in, toes turned outwards (feet in a V shape) with legs far apart. As you go to the floor, roll your weight along the inward sides of your feet, towards your toes, while pushing your pelvis forward. The most stressful part will be when your weight is on the inside of your feet on the bones near the big toes. Try to move a bit quicker at this point and roll your feet outwards, then inwards, with toes curled towards bottoms of feet, quickly to end up with backs of feet facing the floor (weight on the backs of the feet).

*Please* do this move holding a sofa and coffee table at home (one on each side of you), or, ideally, using the bar at your dance studio. Make sure you have mats or pillows behind and under you in case you fall. You should also have a spotter while learning this (person behind you with their arms under your back) in case you lose your balance, and to avoid injuring your knees (which is the biggest danger, imo, with this move). You can really hurt yourself doing a backbend to the floor like this, so please, please use caution, take your time learning this, and please use the safety measures I've suggested. This type of move is nearly as dangerous as a Turkish drop.

One more thing (very important), my teacher had me *walk* on the backs on my toes before allowing me to do moves like this. It built up the strength in my feet for these kinds of moves. Gently rest the weight of your leg on the backs of your toes (don't push your leg down!). Gently stretch the backs of your feet and the muscle over your shin in this position for about 10 seconds. If this is uncomfortable, do not proceed with the following. If it doesn't hurt, then you can *walk* on carpet with the backs of your toes, holding onto a counter top with *both* hands (and leaning your weight onto your hands to begin with). Only do this for a few seconds, working up to about a minute, each day until you build up your feet's strength. I wouldn't try this backbend transistion until you can do this exercise for at least 15 seconds, without holding onto anything, with minimal discomfort. If your feet don't take your weight your knees will, and this move can blow them out. And if your feet aren't strong enough, you can break a bone. Hope this helps.

 

[Aniseteph]

Blimey. I am so never going to try that. My knees don't even like me thinking about it. :shok:

 

[Mara2]

Blimey. I am so never going to try that. My knees don't even like me thinking about it. :shok:

hehe Smart Girl This is why I hate giving advice about advanced moves online. It's sooo difficult to explain online without a visual, and I think many people don't really appreciate how dangerous some of these moves can be.

 

[RioDancerCO]

Thanks Mara2,
I appreciate your concern about proper safety while trying to learn this move. I have already built my flexibility and core and leg stregth through yoga and such so mostly I just needed a description of the foot transition. Your advice on foot strengthening is well taken. I'm pretty sure I can already do that because of some yoga transitions that require you to roll over your toes but I will definitely test it out on carpet well before trying to bend.