Orientalism

khanjar

New member
You've just hit the nail on the head. The only complaint that I have with the series is that it didn't include this part of the puzzle. The myth of "Whiteness". It's all a ruse isn't it? Racial classification. They created it so that they could enlist the aide of the masses. To deflect their anger by creating an enemy, a boggyman, a threat. They created a caste system in which "white people" were placed on the top of the scale. They gave them a few more privileges, they gave them status and in a world where status was everything, now they had something, even if it was only a concept. But look closely, would the average "white man or woman" be given in marriage to a Mountbatten or anyone of that circle? Not all the whiteness in the world could pull that off. But the thing is, they always knew that even if they were paupers, they had authority over the highest ranking Asian, African or Native American. What better way to get the masses on your side and ensure they are willing to fight for your interests? Who in their right mind would want to give up that kind of power? Only problem is that it is only an illusion, and whenever the master feels like it, he can take that power. Your secure factory job can vanish over seas. Your rights can be eroded. So in reality the masses are the ultimate house negroes. We really are all the same and it is that truth the powers that be are afraid we will realize. That the average white person and the average black person have more in common with each other than the average white person has with the "White" Capitalist class.

You know, I once dissolved a nasty situation, a fight between an Asian and an Englishman, that Englishman was me, The Asian chap had so much hatred, he was going around looking for something soft to hit, vent his anger and what was better than a representative of the white race which he felt oppressed him and hated his ethnicity.

There was a scuffle, nothing serious, but not a fight, this chap had the ability to listen. I told him I didn't want to fight, I am not interested in fighting as I bore no hatred or even dislike to his race or him and I said I understood his anger. The oppression he felt, we have all been oppressed and furthermore the ethnicity classification is really a load of oblox, a classification brought about only by those that sought to segregate, be they scientists for the means of study or oppressors as a means to empower themselves.

Even the celt which I at that time clung to due to Irish and Cornish ancestry was described by an ancient writer, I forget which, whether he be Roman or Grecian, but this person described the Briton as dark and swarthy. Well, who in our country could be described as dark and swarthy looking, Asians perhaps ? If that is so, we are all the same.

But the 'ethnicity' of celt that we all cling to in reality means nothing, even the word is derived from a Grecian word for ' uncivilised '. Uncivilised is not an ethnicity. And to those who claim they are of celtic ancestry, well, here in Britain at least, probably the entire poulation is of celtic ancestry and at the same time, Norse ancestry, saxon ancestry, Norman ancestry and not to forget Roman ancestry. The latter, Roman was not one country, but a collection of conquered countries brought into the ownership of Roman rule.

Further back there is even suggestion that those that were described as Keltoi whom I understand originated on the Indo Iranian plateau, actually came from the Sahara area of North Africa which at the time fifteen thousand years ago was a massive prairie. The people that were pushed off the prairie could be described as what we know now as oriental looking, perhaps the dark and swarthy appearance mentioned.

So, we are all of the same people, we come from the same part of the world and if you even look to the Adam and Eve idea, we are all brothers and sisters.

So, this disagreement I was involved in was dissolved, I told this chap immediate ethnicity is in reality irrelevant, we are all the same and if he wanted to understand his place in the world, then he must look further than the petty differences set up in the last couple of hundred years by an elite who even we despise.

(If it interests, some information on the origin of the Briton and for that matter, the rest of the world ) ;
Origin of the Celts - Caucasian, not European

Oh and those celto/Roman/Norman/Norse/Asian/Oriental people that lived in Britain and Europe have in recent years, only a few hundred years, being recent in the scale of things have moved to a new part of the world, the continent which is now called America. These new people became the power in America bringing to this land the same disease, perhaps this disease being the reason they left their homelands and sail across the western ocean to this land of opportunity.
 
Last edited:

Caroline_afifi

New member
You know, I once dissolved a nasty situation, a fight between an Asian and an Englishman, that Englishman was me, The Asian chap had so much hatred, he was going around looking for something soft to hit, vent his anger and what was better than a representative of the white race which he felt oppressed him and hated his ethnicity.

There was a scuffle, nothing serious, but not a fight, this chap had the ability to listen. I told him I didn't want to fight, I am not interested in fighting as I bore no hatred or even dislike to his race or him and I said I understood his anger. The oppression he felt, we have all been oppressed and furthermore the ethnicity classification is really a load of oblox, a classification brought about only by those that sought to segregate, be they scientists for the means of study or oppressors as a means to empower themselves.

Even the celt which I at that time clung to due to Irish and Cornish ancestry was described by an ancient writer, I forget which, whether he be Roman or Grecian, but this person described the Briton as dark and swarthy. Well, who in our country could be described as dark and swarthy looking, Asians perhaps ? If that is so, we are all the same.

But the 'ethnicity' of celt that we all cling to in reality means nothing, even the word is derived from a Grecian word for ' uncivilised '. Uncivilised is not an ethnicity. And to those who claim they are of celtic ancestry, well, here in Britain at least, probably the entire poulation is of celtic ancestry and at the same time, Norse ancestry, saxon ancestry, Norman ancestry and not to forget Roman ancestry. The latter, Roman was not one country, but a collection of conquered countries brought into the ownership of Roman rule.

Further back there is even suggestion that those that were described as Keltoi whom I understand originated on the Indo Iranian plateau, actually came from the Sahara area of North Africa which at the time fifteen thousand years ago was a massive prairie. The people that were pushed off the prairie could be described as what we know now as oriental looking, perhaps the dark and swarthy appearance mentioned.

So, we are all of the same people, we come from the same part of the world and if you even look to the Adam and Eve idea, we are all brothers and sisters.

So, this disagreement I was involved in was dissolved, I told this chap immediate ethnicity is in reality irrelevant, we are all the same and if he wanted to understand his place in the world, then he must look further than the petty differences set up in the last couple of hundred years by an elite who even we despise.

(If it interests, some information on the origin of the Briton and for that matter, the rest of the world ) ;
Origin of the Celts - Caucasian, not European

Oh and those celto/Roman/Norman/Norse/Asian/Oriental people that lived in Britain and Europe have in recent years, only a few hundred years, being recent in the scale of things have moved to a new part of the world, the continent which is now called America. These new people became the power in America bringing to this land the same disease, perhaps this disease being the reason they left their homelands and sail across the western ocean to this land of opportunity.

This is a great post Khanjar and your thoughts on this subject are true.


The UK was invaded many many times and the place was a big bloody mess for a long long time.
There always seemed to be the need for a fight and still is, but many thankfully have switched to fight good causes.
I suppose with our history, it does not surprise me that the abused became the ultimate abuser and vice versa.
People fear anything which is different and people are resistant to change, but things do change whether we want it to or not, it is how we manage it.
 

khanjar

New member
And of course the colour of skin .

We are despite our common ancestry all of different shades and colours of skin. Not only is our skin of different colours, but our hair is different coloured and the way it grows.

Now, the way I understand these minor differences, is what colour we are is because of our location in the world. Those who have the dark skin tone of what is described as black, where they are in the world, the darker tones are in the hottest and most sunny parts of the world. A place where the skin and the hair exist as a protection from the sun. Peoples skin colour gets lighter as the country gets cooler until you get to Scotland where the most excellent Scottish comedian, Billy Connolly describes the Scot skin colour as a shade of blue. If this wasn't so, why would us of the North European and North American skin shade darken with the exposure to unusual amounts of sunlight,the sunlight and warmth we actively seek when we go on vacation. Maybe even it is genetically in us to seek our original land of origin ? It is the dream of many in Europe to retire to a place in the sun.

So, those of a darker skin tone in the cooler parts of the world, I have noticed with each generation, the skin tone gets lighter, as the skin type adjusts to the living climate. The hair changes texture and colour and with some I have seen, it bears an interesting similarity to some of those in my country who have the red or at least the reddish tinge to their hair, myself included, the redder stuff in my beard curls, the darker stuff not so curly. With myself, exposure to sunlight, my beard goes from largely dark brown to a browny red.

So, in reality, where is the difference in us all, skin and hair, is likely to be a product of the originating enviroment and all of us who are pale, how we change when we go to these enviroments. If one of the pale stayed in a hotter enviroment, and those that go after them for hundreds perhaps thousands of years, I wonder what they may become.
 

khanjar

New member
This is a great post Khanjar and your thoughts on this subject are true.


The UK was invaded many many times and the place was a big bloody mess for a long long time.
There always seemed to be the need for a fight and still is, but many thankfully have switched to fight good causes.
I suppose with our history, it does not surprise me that the abused became the ultimate abuser and vice versa.
People fear anything which is different and people are resistant to change, but things do change whether we want it to or not, it is how we manage it.

Caroline, I came from a part of Britain where in my youth, there were no blacks or asians, I grew up not knowing and I could honestly say the issue of race was nothing I ever came across. There were Chinese, but we never saw the difference and at that young age, could not even picture this country of China, as tv of the time was not as diverse as it is now.

Then came my being thrust into the real world, where I went to train in Wolverhampton and there I met the diversity of the British people. I will honestly admit to being wary of the different skin colours I encountered, and perhaps a little frightened, bearing in mind I was totally inexperienced to different races.

In time I became used to the different races, had many friends of different races and eventually as I am now, I don't see colour as something to fear, the people I know, yes, their skin colour is different, but that is no reflection on the person, they are the same as everyone else. It has also come to be that I now find the darker skin tones as beautiful. If there is anything to fear in people, it is generally those who can be described as ethnically my own kind, those who are so uneducated that they seek to cause strife with all whom they meet whom they don't know or are different in some minor way.

The more we all come together, every race and colour, the better as a human race we will be and through education and understanding the more accepting we will be, we just have to open our minds to the diversity around us, we are all the same.
 

Caroline_afifi

New member
Caroline, I came from a part of Britain where in my youth, there were no blacks or asians, I grew up not knowing and I could honestly say the issue of race was nothing I ever came across. There were Chinese, but we never saw the difference and at that young age, could not even picture this country of China, as tv of the time was not as diverse as it is now.

Then came my being thrust into the real world, where I went to train in Wolverhampton and there I met the diversity of the British people. I will honestly admit to being wary of the different skin colours I encountered, and perhaps a little frightened, bearing in mind I was totally inexperienced to different races.

In time I became used to the different races, had many friends of different races and eventually as I am now, I don't see colour as something to fear, the people I know, yes, their skin colour is different, but that is no reflection on the person, they are the same as everyone else. It has also come to be that I now find the darker skin tones as beautiful. If there is anything to fear in people, it is generally those who can be described as ethnically my own kind, those who are so uneducated that they seek to cause strife with all whom they meet whom they don't know or are different in some minor way.

The more we all come together, every race and colour, the better as a human race we will be and through education and understanding the more accepting we will be, we just have to open our minds to the diversity around us, we are all the same.

And that is a very honest response. People, especially some older are still afraid of black people and vice versa. Dawn french (the ballet dancer in the vicar of Dibley clip on another thread) went to Africa with her husband Lenny Henry (who is black). They went to a tribe where many had not seen white people. One kid saw her and ran screaming, everyone else stared with horror and thought she was ill. Fearing something because it is different is also different in hating something because it is different.

My grandfather was Syrian and lived in a very 'white' area of Liverpool for all his life and was known as the 'darkie'. My mum changed her name from Selma to Jackie when she was 13 (and is still known by this name, although it is not official) when she started work she got reffered to as 'Paki' Jackie because there were two Jackies in her office. I was always told to say we were spanish and my uncle has still never visited the Middle East, he is still scared to be associated with it in any way.

Things are different now but in many ways but the racism is still very much there.
 

khanjar

New member
The only stumbling block left

The only thing I can now see as a stumbling block to be overcome, is the question of spirituality and religion. I accept everyones belief, it might not be mine, but I will not dislike a person for what peacefully works for them.

There is truth to be found in every belief and something we can all learn from.

Maybe even it is that the truth to be had in every belief, that combined is a better belief for everyone. Maybe even that the truth in all the diverse beliefs are scattered in the hope that one day we will humanity will see sense and that truth will unite us in spirit.
 
Last edited:
Top