Feet and style

gwinity

New member
When dancing, how do you have your feet? Do you dance on the balls of your feet, or remain more grounded, flat-footed?

Does the style you dance affect whether you're on your toes or not?

I ask this, because I'm learning a flat-footed tribal/gypsy style and I'm constantly getting in trouble for lifting my heels in class (I have super-tight ligaments that make flat-footed, bent-knee'd maneouvers difficult). My first teacher taught an Egyptian style, on the toes.

So. Question. Do others who dance flat-footed have issues staying down? If so, what did you do to overcome them, and what advice can you give me? :eek:

The floor is yours........ :p
 

Suhad

New member
For me, it depends on the music, plain and simple. If it's an earthy grounded rhythm like beledi, then I'm flat footed with lots of hip work. It it's an airy instrument, or fast rhythm then either or a combination of both most likely.

I personally agree with your tribal teacher. The movement should be coming mainly from your abdominal muscles/obliques, not your buttocks, if you want to keep your feet grounded. This is not only good form, especially for tribal, but it also enables you to more easily layer shimmies and other things over your base moves, because then you're using two sets of muscles for two different things rather than trying to use the same or opposing sets of the same muscles for those things.

Try REALLY bending your knees more, and REALLY using your abdominals/obliques while practicing in front of a mirror, and you should get it in no time! That's how I mastered those moves, and I started with tribal. It isn't a matter of tight hamstrings so much as it is a much more knee bent, grounded stance. Of course, stretching and yoga poses don't hurt either! :D
 

Amulya

Moderator
I agree with all the things said above. It all depends on the style, but also on what feels comfortable. Movements look different flat footed or when you dance on your toes.
 

Aisha Azar

New member
Style/ Feet

Dear Gwinity,
I know very little about Tribal dance, but in authentic styles of belly dance, Egyptian, Lebanese, Turkish, one is on the toes, on the balls of the feet and flat-footed, depending on what the dancer wants her body to do. There is no static postion, and the dancer does what she needs to do with her feet in order to affect her body in ways that help her create the movement she is trying to perform. Each dancer might have a little bit different way to make her feet help her dance.
Regards,
A'isha
 

gwinity

New member
Thank you for the replies, ladies. :) Until composing my post above, I honestly didn't realise there was *such* a difference from the ground up between the traditional and the newer forms of the dance.

I'm still trying to get the basics perfect (and I have a long way to go for that), and seem to be fighting my body - because of the ligaments/tendons in my feet, knees and legs in general, it's virtually impossible for me to perfect something like a maya with both feet flat!
 

Mouse

New member
Dear Gwinity,
I know very little about Tribal dance, but in authentic styles of belly dance, Egyptian, Lebanese, Turkish, one is on the toes, on the balls of the feet and flat-footed, depending on what the dancer wants her body to do. There is no static postion, and the dancer does what she needs to do with her feet in order to affect her body in ways that help her create the movement she is trying to perform. Each dancer might have a little bit different way to make her feet help her dance.
Regards,
A'isha

I totally agree with A'isha on this one. For me I find it harder when doing a lot of work up on the balls of the feet simply because the energy levels required (for me at least) are much higher and I tend to run out of puff.
 

Gabi

New member
I totally agree with A'isha on this one. For me I find it harder when doing a lot of work up on the balls of the feet simply because the energy levels required (for me at least) are much higher and I tend to run out of puff.

I actually find it harder to stay flat. Have one instructor who likes flat because she's a stickler that EVERY shimmy must come from the knees and pressing the heels helps beginners get it quicker that way.

The other is all toes all the time - great for balance and squatting deeper while vertical.

stretching the upper calves will go a long way to helping - down dog is good too
 

Hadassah

New member
I think it depends on the movement you're doing. I'm Egyptian style, and we do a lot on the balls of our feet, like chu-chu shimmies and 123 steps and such, but we also do more grounded movements like isolated mayas and laterals and figure eights. Also, Saidi style dance is definitely more grounded as opposed to cabaret, which is lighter. I think it's good to be able to do movements both flat footed and in releve, if the movement allows. that way you develop evenly.
 

Moon

New member
gwinity said:
because of the ligaments/tendons in my feet, knees and legs in general, it's virtually impossible for me to perfect something like a maya with both feet flat!

Do you have trouble with your knees if you bend them, Gwinity? If not, try bending your knees more when doing a maya with feet flat, it made a huge difference for me!

Maybe doing movements rather on either flat feet or the balls of the feet also depend on what kind of shoes you wear in everyday life (at least that is my impression). One of the ladies in my class told me she has difficulties doing a shimmy walk the way we learned it in class: on flat feet. She told me she can do it on the balls of her feet, because she's used to wearing high heels all the time in everyday life (which is extremely unhealthy IMO). Once we had a lesson in Tunisian style and we danced on the balls of our feet most of the time. It was quite difficult for me and the balls of my feet started to hurt quite soon. When I looked at some girls that always wear high heels, they seemed to have far less problems with it.

But overall I think the others are right, dancing on either the balls of the feet or on flat feet depends on the style, the movement and the wishes of the dancer.
 

tim ema

New member
This is very interesting! I also didn't realize there was such a difference!

I am flat-footed and have to wear corrective orthodics in my shoes. Without orthodics standing flat and bending my knees for any length of time is VERY painful as the pronation causes all the wrong pulling of tendons in the knees.

When I'm without shoes I am always on my toes. When I was a little girl a doctor told my mother that if I stayed on my toes I would develop an arch - turns out he was full of ****, but we didn't know that then! My mum was always getting after me to pick up my heels! As a result, my heels haven't touched the ground since about 1979! LOL! It's just the way I walk when I'm not wearing my orthodics - I do it without thinking!

Lebanese dancers wear heels and look so beautiful! Maybe I'll do that! LOL!!

:)
AT
 

Shanazel

Moderator
I agree with A'isha Azar. Recently I have found myself doing more dancing on the flat of my feet simply because I have developed a plantar fascia problem (grrrrr). I like my students to learn to do movements such as maya flat footed before they learn the same movement half pointe, simply because then they are not so inclined to use their knees and feet instead of their muscles to drive the movement.

I couldn't dance in heels to save my sole- er, my soul.
 

Aniseteph

New member
Hello all
If you wear high heels a lot you can end up with shortened Achilles tendons (I think), which makes it difficult to put you feet flat.
Hey Tim'ema, your story about the doctor rings a bell. When I was little I they said I had fallen arches, and my "cure" was to scrunch up unrolled bandages and pick up marbles with my toes. :confused: I didn't do it that much and my mum didn't push it, so have gone a long time believing my arches to be a dead loss. But recently I had foot surgery and mentioned it to my GP and he said that was all a load of rubbish and I HAVE got arches. So much for medical expertise...
And Shanazel - if it's plantar fasciitis you've got, I sympathise deeply -ow ow ow.

Wow my feet sound rubbish don't they?:(

Back on thread - we do many moves both flat footed and on balls of feet - depends on the music, how fast the move is, is it travelling etc. And depends on how far along the learning curve we are - Egyptian walk without picking up the heels? One day....

(but I can shimmy for England in high heels! can't walk in 'em though, let alone dance...)
 
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Shanazel

Moderator
Plantar fasciitis. Maybe that's the term the doctor used. If that's where your heel feels like it is badly bruised, that's it.
 

Moon

New member
Aniseteph said:
If you wear high heels a lot you can end up with shortened Achilles tendons (I think), which makes it difficult to put you feet flat.

And shortened calf muscles too :eek:
 

Shanazel

Moderator
Not to mention broken ankles when you finally fall off the high heels. (To misquote my favorite biker: there are two kinds of high heel wearers, those who have fallen and those who are going to fall.)
 

Aniseteph

New member
Plantar fasciitis. Maybe that's the term the doctor used. If that's where your heel feels like it is badly bruised, that's it.

I had it on the ball of my foot:( . It got better eventually with as-much-rest-as-possible and anti-inflammatory tablets...
Hope you are on the road to recovery.
 

gwinity

New member
Yes, years of high heels and a habit of sitting with my feet under me have shortened and tightened the muscles/ligaments/things-that-move in my legs, pulling my kneecap out of alignment (OUCH!!). Some stretches you're only meant to feel in your thigh I can feel pulling all the way down to the soles of my feet!

It's hard, but I'm slowly getting better at keeping my heels flat when dancing. Or I'm not getting told off for it as much. :D
 

Gabi

New member
I had it on the ball of my foot:( . It got better eventually with as-much-rest-as-possible and anti-inflammatory tablets...
Hope you are on the road to recovery.

Yup - to be specific it's a piece of fascia that runs from the heel to the ball of the foot. It's big and it's tough. If worse comes to worse it can be cut to release it a bit as the problem is usually due to it's being too tight.

Been there and it took forever but runners get it all the time :eek:
 

Shanazel

Moderator
I cut back on my walking for a couple of weeks (I usually walk 4 miles 5-6 days a week, which takes about an hour) and my heel is much better. My disposition is worse, but my heel is better. My first fall dance classes started last night and it didn't bother me at all. Now I get to pick the walking back up, which means I'll notice that I haven't walked enough in the last two weeks, which will in turn sour my disposition more. Sigh, and I'm usually such a sweetie:D .
 

tim ema

New member
............Hey Tim'ema, your story about the doctor rings a bell. When I was little I they said I had fallen arches, and my "cure" was to scrunch up unrolled bandages and pick up marbles with my toes. :confused: I didn't do it that much and my mum didn't push it, so have gone a long time believing my arches to be a dead loss. But recently I had foot surgery and mentioned it to my GP and he said that was all a load of rubbish and I HAVE got arches. So much for medical expertise......

~~I'm starting to think I'll give up on doctors and get all my health advice from GOOGLE! LOL!!...then again, my computer can't put a tongue depressor in my mouth! ~~

The up side is, walking in stiletto heels for me is second nature because it's how I walk anyway. hmm....contemplates possible connection to chiropractic problems...

:confused:
AT
 
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