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  1. #21
    V.I.P. Maria_Aya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caroline_afifi View Post
    Simsimiya is used in this pop song but that is where the style ends..

    It is a classic pop song and has been danced 'belly dance' as at every party/wedding i have been to since it came out.

    Some songs have a little 'Saaidi' thing going on, but it does not make it a 'classic Saaidi'.

    Different rhythms and styles are often used and fused in pop.
    Can we swap the arabs that live in Greece with arabs at UK? lol
    The give me a slap for the smallest details lol

  2. #22
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    As a beginner not knowing much, I too myself thought that belly dance was like any other dance, as set of choreographed moves that are interpreted to music.

    it was only when I began buying music, and asking questions of my teacher (who does egyptian and am cab style) that she began to give me the directions in which to go. She didn't force me to look at one style, but to observe many dances and discover what I liked. I started off looking at american dancers, and then started looking at various egyptian dancers and what captured me was how natural they looked...it didn't look contrived, fake or just showing off what "what my body can do". and that natural look was what i wanted to achieve eventually. it is still very much what i want to achieve
    for me it became natural to try to get as much music as possible. so i began listening to what my teacher gave me, asking friends and looking on the internet.

    i guess what i'm trying to say here is that not all beginners are like the beginners that have been described in this thread. I WANT to learn everything. It is sometimes discouraging when the resources aren't that readily available to me, and sometimes i admittedly get jealous or angry when i hear stories like what Eshta described and the students take this "gold mine" for granted.

  3. #23
    V.I.P. shiradotnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eshta View Post
    Also, how authentic really is pop? I haven't yet seen an Egyptian dancer performing to Nancy Ajram (although welcome the opportunity to be proven wrong).
    I don't know about performiing, but I can tell you that both Hamada Hossam (one of the founding members of Reda Troupe) and Dandash have used Egyptian pop music in the classes they taught at Ahlan wa Sahlan. Hamada Hossam's classes introduced me to two pop songs I like a lot, Sabri Aleel and Shamandora. Dandash used Ah Wa Noss by Nancy Ajram.

    I guess my thinking is that if one is going to use pop, it's good to use Egyptian pop rather than American pop. It helps steer student brains into connecting this dance to its cultural origins.

  4. #24
    Moderator Farasha Hanem's Avatar
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    I've suspected all along that what my teacher teaches isn't Egyptian style, but I'm not exactly sure what style she teaches. AmCab, maybe, with heavy leanings toward Tribal Fusion when it comes to music? Anyway, in my first year with her, she used Natacha Atlas' "I Put A Spell On You," also, as well as "Kidda," and a few other songs be Ms. Atlas. She also uses Solace's "Rhythm Of The Dance." This year, she's added Loreena McKinnett's "The Book of Secrets," mainly for the warm-up portion, but she uses the "Marco Polo" track for, um, how do I describe it? Circle dances? We move around in a circle, and take turns doing improv moves which everyone else follows (kind of Musical Chairs meets Simon Says). She also uses a lot of the BDSS CDs.

    She's still young herself, and this is only her second year of teaching, and I figure even beginner teachers have to start somewhere. She does go to seminars, and she does have a determination to grow as a dancer herself, and as a teacher. She's trying, but I can't help but wonder about her own teacher. She's very good as far as technique, and her class even has a live drummer! But I have a feeling my teacher's teacher is teaching her an Americanized version of bellydance, and this seems to be the prevalent style here in my state, from what I've seen so far.

  5. #25
    V.I.P. shiradotnet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farasha Hanem View Post
    I've suspected all along that what my teacher teaches isn't Egyptian style, but I'm not exactly sure what style she teaches. AmCab, maybe, with heavy leanings toward Tribal Fusion when it comes to music?
    This doesn't sound like the American Classic style, either. I spent my first 15 years of belly dancing doing American Classic style, before changing directions and moving toward Egyptian style. (I've been dancing 28 years.) Anyway...

    Even in American Classic style, we use Middle Eastern music - folk songs from Turkey, Armenia, Lebanon, etc. So we'd use music by John Bilezikjian, George Abdo, Harry Saroyan, etc.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Eshta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shiradotnet View Post
    I guess my thinking is that if one is going to use pop, it's good to use Egyptian pop rather than American pop. It helps steer student brains into connecting this dance to its cultural origins.
    Yes, I completely agree with you, it was only this thread that made me pause to question my assumption!

  7. #27
    Senior Member Eshta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kayshier View Post
    As a beginner not knowing much, I too myself thought that belly dance was like any other dance, as set of choreographed moves that are interpreted to music.

    it was only when I began buying music, and asking questions of my teacher (who does egyptian and am cab style) that she began to give me the directions in which to go. She didn't force me to look at one style, but to observe many dances and discover what I liked. I started off looking at american dancers, and then started looking at various egyptian dancers and what captured me was how natural they looked...it didn't look contrived, fake or just showing off what "what my body can do". and that natural look was what i wanted to achieve eventually. it is still very much what i want to achieve
    for me it became natural to try to get as much music as possible. so i began listening to what my teacher gave me, asking friends and looking on the internet.

    i guess what i'm trying to say here is that not all beginners are like the beginners that have been described in this thread. I WANT to learn everything. It is sometimes discouraging when the resources aren't that readily available to me, and sometimes i admittedly get jealous or angry when i hear stories like what Eshta described and the students take this "gold mine" for granted.
    Aww my poor students! They aren't taking me for granted, it's just a lot to take in so early in their dance careers !

    I went through a similar 'voyage of discovery' myself and had to really work hard to discover what it was I didn't know, if that makes sense, and really lucked out with my current teachers. I don't ever want a student of mine to feel the same frustration, nor do I want to misinform them either. It probably explains why I'm putting way too much thought into something that shouldn't be that complex - I haven't even begun to choreograph it yet

  8. #28
    V.I.P. Caroline_afifi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maria_Aya View Post
    Can we swap the arabs that live in Greece with arabs at UK? lol
    The give me a slap for the smallest details lol
    Slap them back!

    I actually mean weddings and parties in Cairo... they dont jump up and dance with spoons every time it comes on! it is a 'bop and pop' song.

    When introducing Arabic music we have to begin with a variety so it becomes familiar.

    Pop these days has many influences and artists draw on many vibes from various parts of the Middle East and beyond.

    I know everyone wears their Spanish skirts for Amr Diabs 'Habibi' but it is not a Spanish song... just an Arab one with a sprinkle of Spanish flavour.

    We can tell classes about the different 'flavours' within the music and explain it in the way we would with music from the West.

    Do you remember the Arabic pop version of Carmena Burena about 15 years ago?

  9. #29
    Moderator Shanazel's Avatar
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    How did I miss Carl Orff as interpreted by Arabs? I'd love to hear it. Carmina Burana was one of our big show pieces when I was singing in the state chorale. Did they translate it into Arabic or sing the bastardized Latin and medieval German? Do you recall who did it, Caroline?

  10. #30
    Premium Member Aniseteph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eshta View Post
    I guess at what point should they start connecting to the music? Could you imagine hip hop or street dance without that connection? And how does one go about creating that connection? Through full immersion or small steps at a time?
    "should", there's an interesting word...

    Who are they? If they are serious bellydance students in the way ballet students would be described as serious, following a curriculum to a goal like joining a professional dance company, then you would be able to say that by a particular stage they should be joining up some of the dots. If not then the teaching is not working () or the entrance criteria are wrong, or maybe the student has personal reasons for not progressing more or less on track. And there shouldn't be qualms about full immersion for this lot, because if this is what you want to do, get used to it.

    The classes/workshops I've been in have never been made up of that kind of student... (good job or I'd not be there). I think I started "getting" the music and having a feel for what moves might fit where after about 2 years, recognising different styles after about 18 months (including going to workshops, which my fellow beginners didn't). Being able to put expression into what I'm doing when dancing in front of anyone - just starting. I have no idea if this is normal or not. It's all a journey - I'd vote small steps and variety.

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