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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mara2 View Post
    Good grief, that thread about Shakira! No facts that I can find yet, only people saying she's not a bellydancer, I don't like her, blahblahblah. Sound like a bunch of jealousy more than anything else. The facts remain that Shakira's LEBANESE grandmother (MIDDLE EASTERN GRANDMA, people) taught her. What is the criteria for being a Middle Eastern dancer around here anyways??? Weird!
    i agree 100% with u

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pirika Repun View Post
    OK. I got you. However, some people call one move for different ways, and sometimes they named their own way, so I don't think you can find exact name for the one move. I'm just wondering, because Egyptians maybe don't care about movement names, why do you care even there is no name for the movements or all different way to call them? Do you study Egyptian style?
    dear pirika
    i love to know everything abt bellydance no matter i study it or not. maybe i'm only curious i just wanna know sweety

  3. #33
    Senior Member Eshta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lily83 View Post
    dear eshta answer my second question first before deciding to do anything. i'm here to aquire info honey not to get my thresd killed. huh
    Hi Lily, I'm not here to kill your thread. I can't answer your second question without seeing the clip. You'll have to post the link.

    I don't want to dampen your enthusiasm, I really like Shakira. I think she's a great singer, songwriter dancer and she's sexy and beautiful without having to resort to being smutty. I acknowledge she has middle eastern heritage. I also explained in my answer earlier that she uses a movement vocabulary and is inspired by middle eastern dance/belly dance. But that is still a long way from it being belly dance.

    You are touching on some very philosophical questions by asking such an innocent one, and good for you that you want to learn. But I would implore you to read the 8 pages of discussion on Shakira's dance style and try to read it with an open mind and realise that it's not everyone 'hating on' Shakira, it's just that we are proud of what we do and work hard at it, and try to keep everyone who bumps and grinds from hitching their cart to the belly dance bandwagon because there is so much more depth to it than shakin' it like Shakira.

  4. #34
    Member Mara2's Avatar
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    There are actually 31 pages there. :O I am dying of curiousity here...so, Middle Eastern dance is not bellydance unless what? Because I was taught old way, and I guess I'm doing it wrong too??

  5. #35
    Senior Member Eshta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mara2 View Post
    Eshta, I sincerely wonder what you are talking about?? I've been a bellydancer for 32 years, and was taught the way Shakira dances. She was taught by her Lebanese grandmother, you don't get any more Middle Eastern dance training than that, do you?? My teacher always said, over and over, to move "like water", "like water". This is how she moves too. So, please, What do you mean? I DO want to know, seriously. I'm totally confused.
    My daddy taught me the Hokey Cokey, but that doesn't make it authentic Irish dancing just because somewhere in my lineage my forefathers came over from Ireland to England.

    If you have middle eastern heritage surely you would be the first to understand the vast difference between what is done by 'professional belly dancers' vs what ordinary people dance etc? Unless your grandma is Fifi Abdo, I would be really surprised if you could gain all you needed to know about belly dance from her. You back this up by mentioning 'your teacher' implying you must have looked elsewhere to advance your training.

    And it may look 'like water' but that is not The distinguishing trademark that determines whether it is authentic belly dance.

    I miss Aisha To quote her to try to sum up:

    Belly dance is only in part bout theose movements. it has its own feeling and spirit and has other elements that make it berlly dance that Shakira does not include in her artistic offerings.

    But then again, I'm probaby just full of it

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eshta View Post
    Hi Lily, I'm not here to kill your thread. I can't answer your second question without seeing the clip. You'll have to post the link.

    I don't want to dampen your enthusiasm, I really like Shakira. I think she's a great singer, songwriter dancer and she's sexy and beautiful without having to resort to being smutty. I acknowledge she has middle eastern heritage. I also explained in my answer earlier that she uses a movement vocabulary and is inspired by middle eastern dance/belly dance. But that is still a long way from it being belly dance.

    You are touching on some very philosophical questions by asking such an innocent one, and good for you that you want to learn. But I would implore you to read the 8 pages of discussion on Shakira's dance style and try to read it with an open mind and realise that it's not everyone 'hating on' Shakira, it's just that we are proud of what we do and work hard at it, and try to keep everyone who bumps and grinds from hitching their cart to the belly dance bandwagon because there is so much more depth to it than shakin' it like Shakira.
    dear eshta
    this is the link
    YouTube - SHAKIRA - Ojos Asi
    the move starts at 1:43 min

    thanx 4 all beautiful things u said abt shakira. i know she is not a bellydancer. she's more than that. she's genious.
    i love to learn from the start no matter wat. i said i'm beginner and i look forward to be professional like shakira. it's my dream don't come my way y'all.

  7. #37
    Member Mara2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eshta View Post
    My daddy taught me the Hokey Cokey, but that doesn't make it authentic Irish dancing just because somewhere in my lineage my forefathers came over from Ireland to England.

    If you have middle eastern heritage surely you would be the first to understand the vast difference between what is done by 'professional belly dancers' vs what ordinary people dance etc? Unless your grandma is Fifi Abdo, I would be really surprised if you could gain all you needed to know about belly dance from her. You back this up by mentioning 'your teacher' implying you must have looked elsewhere to advance your training.

    And it may look 'like water' but that is not The distinguishing trademark that determines whether it is authentic belly dance.

    I miss Aisha To quote her to try to sum up:

    Belly dance is only in part bout theose movements. it has its own feeling and spirit and has other elements that make it berlly dance that Shakira does not include in her artistic offerings.

    But then again, I'm probaby just full of it
    If you watch Middle Eastern videos of weddings, dances, etc., you will see that the dance is universal. Men and women, children and elders all "bellydance" in the Middle East. Yes, some are much better than others, and they can be professionals. *sigh* I just don't get it. What is the hokey cokey? I KNOW moving like water is NOT all there is to it! I trained very hard until my feet bled sometimes. I was raised very hard environment, as a Middle Eastern daughter should be. But now I wonder if I learned something that no one knows is bellydance any more??? IF I wasted all those years of learning? No one does floor work any more, but I learned that too. So, am I completely obsolete now?? WHAT is the distinguishing "trademark"???? ACk! Do you see where I am coming from? Should I hang up my belt after all these years because I am not a bellydancer any more? I mean, if Shakira is not a bellydancer (and she is trained by her Lebanese grandmother), then I guess I am not either?

  8. #38
    Senior Member Eshta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lily83 View Post
    dear eshta
    this is the link
    YouTube - SHAKIRA - Ojos Asi
    the move starts at 1:43 min
    It looks like a very wide legged "hip drop kick", followed by shimmies.

  9. #39
    Member Mara2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lily83 View Post
    hi girls once again

    in the video Ojos Asi while she's dancing on stage live not the clip. she lifts her hands in one side and shakes one hip or moves one leg in one side very fast. what's this called? coz i searched many bellydance videos on this move but couldn't find it's name. please help. sorry for the bad discrption lol.
    I see which video you mean now. She is pushing the hip FORWARDS and gravity is pushing it back to it's original position. She's doing this with her leg. It's hard to explain online, but basically she is using the leg that is pointed outwards to do the movement. I don't know what it's called though. My teacher didn't speak very good English. One dancer I talked with, we talked about how all the hip movements used to be forward, not pushing hips backwards, and she called them flutters, but I don't think that's right. Sorry I'm no help on the name of it.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mara2 View Post
    I see which video you mean now. She is pushing the hip FORWARDS and gravity is pushing it back to it's original position. She's doing this with her leg. It's hard to explain online, but basically she is using the leg that is pointed outwards to do the movement. I don't know what it's called though. My teacher didn't speak very good English. One dancer I talked with, we talked about how all the hip movements used to be forward, not pushing hips backwards, and she called them flutters, but I don't think that's right. Sorry I'm no help on the name of it.
    It's a hip drop with a leg kick, known sometimes in the UK as a 'swerve'. She's leaning backwards slightly so it appears that the move is pushing forwards, which is what she may be doing. The kicking leg releases the hip, so that the hip can also twist backwards slightly during the movement... hence the term, 'swerve'. A basic movement and one which is taught quite early on.

    As with nearly all Shakira's movements, she's over extending and exaggerating the movement so it takes on a whole new look and has more energy. But when a dancer does this, there can be injuries. So her way of executing this move is perhaps not for beginners.

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