Aziza of Cairo - my current obsession

Salome

Administrator
I like her as well. She controls her energy really well, there is total intention and energy into every movement. Really refreshing.
 

charlieL

New member
Can someone tell me why some dancers choose the same stage name of other dancers;i.e this Aziza, Aziza the American bellydancer and Aziza mor saidi from Brazil, there is even an American dancer called Shakira.
 

Erik

New member
Can someone tell me why some dancers choose the same stage name of other dancers;i.e this Aziza, Aziza the American bellydancer and Aziza mor saidi from Brazil, there is even an American dancer called Shakira.
I'll try. These names have been in existence for a long time, and there are a lot more dancers than names available. If each name were used only once it would result in increasingly outlandish made-up names.

From a thread on Tribe a year or two ago I gathered that it is bad etiquette to deliberately copy the stage name of a established dancer performing in the same area, but otherwise it's okay.
 

Yame

New member
Can someone tell me why some dancers choose the same stage name of other dancers;i.e this Aziza, Aziza the American bellydancer and Aziza mor saidi from Brazil, there is even an American dancer called Shakira.
That would be sort of like asking why parents would name their kids a name that already exists. Why name your child John, when there are so many other Johns out there?
 

charlieL

New member
That would be sort of like asking why parents would name their kids a name that already exists. Why name your child John, when there are so many other Johns out there?
I,ve been specific, i meant STAGE NAME, OR ARTISTIC NAME not given names, take this for example, Saida is the stage of the famous Argentinian dancer, but her real name, that is HER GIVEN NAME is Veronica Helou but there is a dancer who know that Saida exists but decides to use Saida as the dancer name, you got me now?
 

Yame

New member
I,ve been specific, i meant STAGE NAME, OR ARTISTIC NAME not given names, take this for example, Saida is the stage of the famous Argentinian dancer, but her real name, that is HER GIVEN NAME is Veronica Helou but there is a dancer who know that Saida exists but decides to use Saida as the dancer name, you got me now?
I got you the first time. I was making a comparison. Ask yourself why people name their children names that already exist. It's the same answer to a slightly different question. But since you can't figure it out, let me answer for you:

1. People use names they like. Sometimes, these names are common, sometimes they are not.

2. You can't make up a new name for every person that is born, or even for every performer that is out there. Hence, repeat names are bound to exist.

Why would you name your kid John? Or Charlie? Because you like the name. Because you like the history or meaning behind the name. Likewise, why would a dancer name herself Aziza? Because she likes the name, or the meaning of the name. Why does it matter that there are other Azizas out there? Most names (real names OR stage names) are already "taken" anyway.

BTW the American belly dancer named Shakira was already out performing professionally under that stage name long before Shakira the singer became famous in the US. You are making a wrongful assumption that every dancer who has a name that is the same as someone more famous than they purposely "copied" the name. A dancer can't possibly know every single name that is out there. Even if you try to be original, there is a chance someone out there already has that name, and there is a chance that other person could become famous.
 

Salome

Administrator
There are a few Salomes' out there, maybe not as many as Azizas' but still I can answer from my experience... Salome is my grandmothers given name and when I was a baby dancer my mom decided on that name for me as my dance name. I love the name, I love that it is part of my grandmother and that my mother chose it for me...
 

charlieL

New member
There are a few Salomes' out there, maybe not as many as Azizas' but still I can answer from my experience... Salome is my grandmothers given name and when I was a baby dancer my mom decided on that name for me as my dance name. I love the name, I love that it is part of my grandmother and that my mother chose it for me...
Another example; why a new pop singer would choose Madonna or Lady Gaga as her artistic name? In my country a musician chose Chayanne as his artistic name and the Puerto Rican singer sued him because he chose his stage name knowing him.
 

Erik

New member
Yame, I'm sorry for my participation in the hijacking of your thread about Aziza of Cairo. Didn't think to say that earlier. Fridays remind me of "The Matrix." I'm moving in slow-mo and everything around me is a blur.

Charlie, you mentioned Shakira and Madonna. In case you didn't know it, these are not just their stage names. These are their actual given names. Michael Caine's wife of many years is also named Shakira, so the name was in usage before the singer known as Shakira made her first stage appearance. [BTW, Michael's real name is Maurice Micklewhite.]

When I was first reading on the Internet about movie stars of the past, I was very surprised to learn that Victor Mature's real name was........Victor Mature! And I would have bet everything I had that it was a made-up Hollywood hero kind of name. He was also very humorous, down-to-earth, and didn't take his acting career seriously at all......but I'm rambling again.

I would imagine it's very difficult to prevent someone from using one's name when that name was in existence previously.
 

charlieL

New member
Yame, I'm sorry for my participation in the hijacking of your thread about Aziza of Cairo. Didn't think to say that earlier. Fridays remind me of "The Matrix." I'm moving in slow-mo and everything around me is a blur.

Charlie, you mentioned Shakira and Madonna. In case you didn't know it, these are not just their stage names. These are their actual given names. Michael Caine's wife of many years is also named Shakira, so the name was in usage before the singer known as Shakira made her first stage appearance. [BTW, Michael's real name is Maurice Micklewhite.]

When I was first reading on the Internet about movie stars of the past, I was very surprised to learn that Victor Mature's real name was........Victor Mature! And I would have bet everything I had that it was a made-up Hollywood hero kind of name. He was also very humorous, down-to-earth, and didn't take his acting career seriously at all......but I'm rambling again.

I would imagine it's very difficult to prevent someone from using one's name when that name was in existence previously.
Ok, i know Shakira and Madonna are given names but i put the example of Saida, who is a stage name of the Argentinian dancer whose real name is Veronica Helou, Chayanne the Puerto Rican pop singer whose real name is Elmer Figueroa, well my point is that there are some dancer who intentionally choose stage names of known dancers, i dont mean the American Aziza or the Brazilian or Cairo dancers chose their names knowing that other dancers named Azizas or if they are their given names, what drew me the atention is that many dancer are called Azizam maybe it`s a coicidence.
 

Yame

New member
Another example; why a new pop singer would choose Madonna or Lady Gaga as her artistic name? In my country a musician chose Chayanne as his artistic name and the Puerto Rican singer sued him because he chose his stage name knowing him.
"Madonna" and "Lady Gaga" aren't common names someone might just pick by coincidence. Belly dance stage names are different because often they are just common (or not so common) Arabic names. "Aziza," "Yasmina," "Farasha," "Fatima," "Nour," etc are just regular names.

Personally, I use my real name to perform, but someone who has a common American/European/whathaveyou name and wants to sound more exotic or Arabic will usually Arabize their own name, or pick another name they can identify with. Very few people will just make up a name out of thin air like "Lady Gaga," hence the chances of repeat names in belly dance are much greater.

Furthermore, Madonna and now Lady Gaga are ubiquitous figures. Everyone the world over knows who they are. Definitely someone who wants to get into show business knows who they are. It's impossible to even accidentally pick the same name.

There is no Madonna or Lady Gaga of belly dance. Even the most famous belly dancers are not household names, aside from the stars of Egypt being well known in Egypt and some other countries in the Middle East and by the more dedicated dancers. There are regional stars, and there are people who are famous around the world, but none of them are known *everywhere.*

There are plenty of people who don't know who Saida is. Every belly dancer in Argentina knows who she is. But outside of South America, although I'd still say she is famous, she is definitely not ubiquitous. I post her videos on Facebook all the time and there are still people who come up to me to talk about them and refer to her as "... that dancer." And once again, "Saida" is just a name. There are plenty of people all over the world named Saida. Saida the Argentinian belly dancer does not "own" the name.

I know plenty of people who have the same stage name as someone else. I don't know a single person that has done it intentionally.
 

charlieL

New member
"Madonna" and "Lady Gaga" aren't common names someone might just pick by coincidence. Belly dance stage names are different because often they are just common (or not so common) Arabic names. "Aziza," "Yasmina," "Farasha," "Fatima," "Nour," etc are just regular names.

Personally, I use my real name to perform, but someone who has a common American/European/whathaveyou name and wants to sound more exotic or Arabic will usually Arabize their own name, or pick another name they can identify with. Very few people will just make up a name out of thin air like "Lady Gaga," hence the chances of repeat names in belly dance are much greater.

Furthermore, Madonna and now Lady Gaga are ubiquitous figures. Everyone the world over knows who they are. Definitely someone who wants to get into show business knows who they are. It's impossible to even accidentally pick the same name.

There is no Madonna or Lady Gaga of belly dance. Even the most famous belly dancers are not household names, aside from the stars of Egypt being well known in Egypt and some other countries in the Middle East and by the more dedicated dancers. There are regional stars, and there are people who are famous around the world, but none of them are known *everywhere.*

There are plenty of people who don't know who Saida is. Every belly dancer in Argentina knows who she is. But outside of South America, although I'd still say she is famous, she is definitely not ubiquitous. I post her videos on Facebook all the time and there are still people who come up to me to talk about them and refer to her as "... that dancer." And once again, "Saida" is just a name. There are plenty of people all over the world named Saida. Saida the Argentinian belly dancer does not "own" the name.

I know plenty of people who have the same stage name as someone else. I don't know a single person that has done it intentionally.
When you refer Madonna and Lady Gaga it`s the same situation with Shakira, althougt Shakira is her real name.
 

Aniseteph

New member
When you refer Madonna and Lady Gaga it`s the same situation with Shakira, althougt Shakira is her real name.
I don't understand this.

There is a Lebanese singer called Madonna. Just because someone is hugely famous in one place, to the point that using the same name would be making some kind of statement, doesn't mean they are that big a deal at another place or at another time. Maybe Cairo Aziza had never heard of Canadian Aziza, and maybe her target market don't have that association either.

Also once there are a lot of them out there, who cares? You just stick another name or place alongside the name and no one really thinks you are THAT Aziza or even associating yourself with them.
 

Yame

New member
When you refer Madonna and Lady Gaga it`s the same situation with Shakira, althougt Shakira is her real name.
No, it's not the same situation. "Shakira" isn't a random made up name like "Lady Gaga," it's a real Arabic name that real people have, and have had, long before the singer Shakira was born.

And once again as I said before, the dancer named Shakira was already using that stage name before she even knew who the singer Shakira was because the latter was not yet famous in the United States. So I'm not sure what your point is here.
 

Stephanie

New member
Shakira and Madonna are using their real names.

Lady Gaga's real name is Stefani Joanne Angelina Germanotta, so Lady Gaga is her stage name. Not her real name, and not a common first name.
 

charlieL

New member
No, it's not the same situation. "Shakira" isn't a random made up name like "Lady Gaga," it's a real Arabic name that real people have, and have had, long before the singer Shakira was born.

And once again as I said before, the dancer named Shakira was already using that stage name before she even knew who the singer Shakira was because the latter was not yet famous in the United States. So I'm not sure what your point is here.
That`s what i wrote, Shakira is her real name, the dancer named Shakira is one of the few exceptions.
 

lily_raks

New member
she's amazing!!! I love it when it seems simple but it is full of feeling and skill. It is effortless and so natural. You see so many dancers out there more concentrated on showing off all they can do instead of feeling the music. There are no props here, no shimmying throughout the whole song or a carefully elaborated choreography. Just an extremely talented and graceful dancer that amazes even when she's just taking a pause. I'm not saying props, choreographies, or tons of shimmying are not good. It is just so refreshing to watch these type of shows. But I love egyptian style so I may be a little biased :)
 
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