Dogs Skinned in China to make fake UGG boots.

[Mya]

I haven't posted in a long time, though i have been lurking every now and then. but this made me very very sad. literally reduced me to tears and i'm telling everyone i can so that the awareness is out there.

Please, PLEASE do not buy fake UGGs from China.

News Article:

Raccoon dogs skinned alive in shocking video

Video (VERY Graphic and heartbreaking):

Animals are Skinned Alive on Chinese Fur Farms - YouTube



Mya

 

[Erik]

Never heard of UGG boots until a piece of spam appeared on this web site. I reported it, and it soon disappeared. Shortly afterward Sean Hannity mentioned on the radio that he still possessed an old pair of UGGs. Saw the link on AOL news regarding the ugly truth about these fake UGG boots but did not click on it.

In the Far East dogs have routinely been used as food for many years. A law enacted in China forbade everyone except soldiers, scientists, and circus performers from owning a dog.

In WWII the Soviet Union trained dogs to run with anti-tank mines harnessed on their backs in suicidal missions under invading German tanks. After the war they also put the first dog in orbit, but with no plans on bringing the dog back alive. At least they were kind enough to poison the dog before it burned alive from reentry.

Something to think about for dog lovers who believe that socialism is such a great deal.

 

[Erik]

Sorry. Double post in an attempt to correct a capitalization error. [It works on Tribe.net.]

 

[Mosaic]

I can't watch the videos, just the thought makes me feel ill. As Erik said Dogs have been bred as a meat source for hundreds of years in China, though that is changing now, many dogs are very pampered pets, but I am sure dogs for food is still happening, as for skinning any animal alive that is just horrendous and grossly sickening. The terrible sufferring of those poor animals, impossible to imagine or come too terms with <shudder>
~Mosaic

 

[Mya]

you know...my MSc is in International Relations....i've studied international trade and development for years....since undergrad and through two years of grad school so i know and understand how China's trade policy works.

Though for me the ethics of farming animals solely for their skin/coat (where that entails ending the animals' life for the procurement of such) is still up in the air, the one thing i can not come to terms with is the outright cruelty of skinning animals alive.

I have a very evidence based mind so i watched a short part of the video about 45 seconds....enough to see if it was real as so many of these things are hoaxes and you need to do your due diligence and all that. but i was mortified.

i am not a spiteful person, but when people mistreat animals in this way (in any country of the world), i genuinely hope that there is an alien apocalypse in future during which they themselves are skinned alive and made into space suits.

 

[Mosaic]

you know...my MSc is in International Relations....i've studied international trade and development for years....since undergrad and through two years of grad school so i know and understand how China's trade policy works.

Though for me the ethics of farming animals solely for their skin/coat (where that entails ending the animals' life for the procurement of such) is still up in the air, the one thing i can not come to terms with is the outright cruelty of skinning animals alive.

I have a very evidence based mind so i watched a short part of the video about 45 seconds....enough to see if it was real as so many of these things are hoaxes and you need to do your due diligence and all that. but i was mortified.

i am not a spiteful person, but when people mistreat animals in this way (in any country of the world), i genuinely hope that there is an alien apocalypse in future during which they themselves are skinned alive and made into space suits.

I understand fully your thoughts on what should happen to such cruel and inhumane people. I have had thoughts of actually wielding the knife :lol:
~Mosaic

 

[Amanda (was Aziyade)]

I couldn't watch these, but I went to snopes HOPING that this was fake, and it seems it is sadly, very real.

But take a look at Snopes' last paragraph on this article:
snopes.com: St. Bernard Petition

I find that extremely offensive. "Our" standards don't advocate the torture of farm animals either. This isn't about cultural insensitivity or attempting to deprive people of a food source. I think snopes was way off the mark on this one.

 

[Mosaic]

I couldn't watch these, but I went to snopes HOPING that this was fake, and it seems it is sadly, very real.

But take a look at Snopes' last paragraph on this article:
snopes.com: St. Bernard Petition

I find that extremely offensive. "Our" standards don't advocate the torture of farm animals either. This isn't about cultural insensitivity or attempting to deprive people of a food source. I think snopes was way off the mark on this one.

I agree that last paragraph is offensive. Legally killed animals are not skinned alive! What is that person ranting about, Yes the odd sicko psychopath may torture defensive animals but anyone ( as far as I know) who kills for meat does so humanely. The thought of any animal being tortured prior to human consumption makes me feel decidedly ill. Seems the petition hasn't had much impact on the practice, seeing it was dated as 2001. That is so, so sad.
~Mosaic

 

[Dev]

Though for me the ethics of farming animals solely for their skin/coat (where that entails ending the animals' life for the procurement of such) is still up in the air, the one thing i can not come to terms with is the outright cruelty of skinning animals alive.

I don't understand why the animal has to be alive to remove its skin . And I agree with everybody its barbaric and disgusting.

However I don't have a problem with uggboots made of dogs leather , neither I have a problem with people eating dogs meat. It will be hypocritical for me to criticise people for eating dog meat, when I eat various other animal meat beef and chicken ect. Similarly I view designer bags made of fox skins are no different to uggboot made of dogs leather.

Something to think about for dog lovers who believe that socialism is such a great deal.

Hi Erik , in my opinion animal cruelty is nothing to do with socialism or capitalism etc. I am not going to elaborate but throughout 60s and 70s in the name of research we did plenty of ungratifying things with animals. And in Western countries pitbull dog fighting is still very popular, you know what happens to the loosing dog?

 

[Erik]

Hi Erik , in my opinion animal cruelty is nothing to do with socialism or capitalism etc. I am not going to elaborate but throughout 60s and 70s in the name of research we did plenty of ungratifying things with animals. And in Western countries pitbull dog fighting is still very popular, you know what happens to the loosing dog?

Hi Dev. You are right. I was rather fired up and it occurred to me later that the West isn't blameless when it comes to animal cruelty.

As a matter of fact, I recently asked on the IMDb about the last scene of a movie I remembered but did not know the title. Someone found it for me and the movie was called "Fresh." It led to a discussion of pitbull fighting and there I learned what happens to the losing dog. I wish now that I could un-know it, but it's too late.

Also could not remember the name of the first space dog after posting last night so I had to know that too. Her name was Laika, and I accidentally learned evidence surfaced in 2002 that she died from overheating when Sputnik 2 came down, and the "sleeping medicine" story was just that.

Anyway, sorry if I offended anyone. Nothing deserves to be skinned alive. If that is happening here as well I certainly hope it is illegal.

 

[Amanda (was Aziyade)]

It is entirely possible to eat animals and use their skins in a cruety-free way. My mom grew up on a rural farm. All the meat they ate came from that farm, and my uncles and granddad used to do the slaughter. It's not cost-effective for the mass market, however, which is why we don't opt for those "free range" $50 steaks in the US. Everybody wants happy cows, "lightly killed" -- but we want WalMart pricing.

Now you can argue that eating meat or using fur is morally wrong. I won't disagree or argue. But it IS possible to slaughter animals without torturing them or creating extreme stress in them.

Slaughtering any animal in an inhumane way is just wrong. Whether it's the factory farmed animal, or torturing a dog to death. It's just wrong and every human on this planet knows it's wrong to subject a living thing to such fear and pain.

The culture in America is not "enthusiastic" about eating horse meat. I guess it goes back to the cowboy image, but you will not find horsemeat in a normal grocery (for human consumption). However, we're totally cool with beef, pork, chicken, etc. -- the same animals that other cultures are not enthusiastic about eating. I could never eat dog without wondering how it was slaughtered, and without reflecting upon my best 4-legged buddy sitting on the couch beside me. My American culture discourages the eating of dog and cat, but I do understand that it's common in other countries, where maybe eating a cow is considered weird and ghoulish.

I have some serious issues with China and southeast Asia, though. Traditional Chinese medicine relies on sympathetic magic and will prescribe something like powdered tiger's penis for impotence. Despite the fact that
1. It doesn't work, and
2. The sale of tiger's penis means slaughtering an endangered animal,
the practitioners of said folk magic refuse to change. I have a hard time accepting the selfishness inherent in that mindset.


Personally, I am however, totally against fur. If you aren't eating the animal, and you live in a 1st world nation, I find no reason to kill it for its skin. I think that's morally repugnant for the 21st century when we can afford synthetic fibers that are much warmer and entirely cruelty-free. If you aren't staving off a freezing winter in the tundra, then use of fur is simply a cosmetic and fashion thing, and I find that offensive. Personally. JMHO.

 

[LunaXJJ]

1. Never heard of, or saw a raccoon dog, they're so cute. I would love to know is genetic history.

2. I hate UGG boots. Ready for the bad pun? I find them UGGly. Either way, I'll let other people who like them know. Makes you wonder about other things we get from China.

 

[Sirène]

Yes the odd sicko psychopath may torture defensive animals but anyone ( as far as I know) who kills for meat does so humanely.

God bless Australians if that's the case over there, but the U.S. meat processing industry is lying through their teeth when they say they butcher humanely. Animals are routinely inadequately stunned before they are 'processed' and a blind-eye is turned to the sometimes barbaric behavior of slaughterhouse workers. Industrialized farming is one of the worse things to happen to this country, but so many people are stuck on the idea of meat at $3.99/lb that they don't bother to look too closely at the origins of their food. I am not a vegetarian, but I do believe that an animal shouldn't be tortured just because it's destined for the dinner table or the closet.

Eating Animals by Jonathan Safran Foer is well-thought read on the topic if you are interested.

 

[Yame]

God bless Australians if that's the case over there, but the U.S. meat processing industry is lying through their teeth when they say they butcher humanely. Animals are routinely inadequately stunned before they are 'processed' and a blind-eye is turned to the sometimes barbaric behavior of slaughterhouse workers. Industrialized farming is one of the worse things to happen to this country, but so many people are stuck on the idea of meat at $3.99/lb that they don't bother to look too closely at the origins of their food. I am not a vegetarian, but I do believe that an animal shouldn't be tortured just because it's destined for the dinner table or the closet.

Eating Animals by Jonathan Safran Foer is well-thought read on the topic if you are interested.

Precisely. Animal Liberation by Peter Singer is also a wonderful book which touches upon the industrial meat farming industry among other animal cruelty topics. I am by no means vegetarian, but I am also not in denial about what it is that I am eating, and admire those who can make it without eating meat.

I am not going to sit here and justify eating meat and pretend what I do is somehow less cruel to animals than all this other oddball stuff like the fur industry (which was once much more accepted, but is not considered by most to be cruel). I am not going to sit here and pretend eating chickens and cows is somehow less cruel than eating a dog.

Because I know that is isn't. I have read about and seen what those animals go through, and it's not pretty. With some very few exceptions ("old school" family farms, free range farms, etc), our meat comes from intensive farming where animals are raised in tiny spaces, indoors, where they can hardly move or stretch their limbs during their entire existence, sitting on top of their own sh!t, being fed antibiotics out the wazoo so they don't get sick. They don't get to eat the foods they would naturally eat. Some are genetically engineered to the point where they are too large for their own legs to support their weight, among other painful abnormalities. The little chicks have their beaks cut off so they won't peck one another, which must be extremely painful. These animals live a life of pain and suffering, and when it's time for slaughter the killing is neither fast nor easy for them.

This doesn't negate how awful it is to skin animals alive for leather, fur, ugg boots, whatever whether we are talking about snakes, foxes, or dogs. It's very awful, it must be one of the most painful things a sentient being could ever go through. But please, before pointing fingers at what other people are doing in other countries, let's take a look at our own cultures and the things that we are doing which are very much comparable.

Perhaps I am a hypocrite for knowing just how bad the meat industry is, and still eating meat. But I'd rather know than be in denial, even if in the end I make the choice to continue eating it. The least I can do is be informed about the subject and let people know as well. The more aware we are, the more we can do something to change the status quo, such as demand improved conditions for animals that are raised for slaughter and give incentives for people to create and sell meat alternatives.

 

[Erik]

Perhaps I am a hypocrite for knowing just how bad the meat industry is, and still eating meat. But I'd rather know than be in denial, even if in the end I make the choice to continue eating it. The least I can do is be informed about the subject and let people know as well. The more aware we are, the more we can do something to change the status quo, such as demand improved conditions for animals that are raised for slaughter and give incentives for people to create and sell meat alternatives.

Well said, Yame. If you're a hypocrite then so am I. I've never eaten lobster and don't plan to because I know how it is prepared. However, I have eaten crab and shrimp which for all I know were prepared in the same way.

For any of you who do eat lobster, there is a method of killing it humanely.
The humane way to cook a lobster - Seafood - Helium

Also did some reading about the genuine UGG boots from Australia (not the Chinese knockoffs), and according to PETA they may not be 100% humane either.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chloe-spencer/ugg-boots-the controversi_b_742649.html

 

[Mya]

I don't understand why the animal has to be alive to remove its skin . And I agree with everybody its barbaric and disgusting.

However I don't have a problem with uggboots made of dogs leather , neither I have a problem with people eating dogs meat. It will be hypocritical for me to criticise people for eating dog meat, when I eat various other animal meat beef and chicken ect. Similarly I view designer bags made of fox skins are no different to uggboot made of dogs leather.

Dev, my problem is not so much that they are made of the skins, but that they are made of the skins of animals that were tortured horrendously in order to procure said skins. i would feel the same way if it were any other animal fox, snake etc.

As far as eating them. it is my personal philosophy to not eat companion animals. i realise that these animals differ from culture to culture and recognise the right of people to do so, so i do my best to reserve judgement, but i simply wouldn't do it myself or patronise those establishments if visiting those countries. that is all.

 

[Mya]

I am not going to sit here and justify eating meat and pretend what I do is somehow less cruel to animals than all this other oddball stuff like the fur industry (which was once much more accepted, but is not considered by most to be cruel). I am not going to sit here and pretend eating chickens and cows is somehow less cruel than eating a dog.

Because I know that is isn't. I have read about and seen what those animals go through, and it's not pretty. With some very few exceptions ("old school" family farms, free range farms, etc), our meat comes from intensive farming where animals are raised in tiny spaces, indoors, where they can hardly move or stretch their limbs during their entire existence, sitting on top of their own sh!t, being fed antibiotics out the wazoo so they don't get sick. They don't get to eat the foods they would naturally eat. Some are genetically engineered to the point where they are too large for their own legs to support their weight, among other painful abnormalities. The little chicks have their beaks cut off so they won't peck one another, which must be extremely painful. These animals live a life of pain and suffering, and when it's time for slaughter the killing is neither fast nor easy for them.

This is very true... i am very sad about some of the things you have highlighted there, i have never heard them before and they are awful!

in my country, most of our meat does come from small farms, and if you go into the country you can see some of them have huge enclosures with chickens running around or cows and goats grazing.. sometimes on the highway though i see them transporting chickens in large trucks and it makes me sad to see when in some cases they are stuffed into crates. if there were a way to tell which farm it was and in turn be able to identify the product, i personally wouldn't buy it. but it isn't possible here.

i myself do not eat very much meat at all, i used to be a vegetarian, but even though i ate alot of legumes, i wasn't getting enough protein still and it was becoming a serious health issue so my doctor said i need to eat some meat, so i eat once or twice some weeks and try to make one of those times eggs.

I realised just last night that there appears to be a serious issue with animal slaughter in the US, as i saw several advertisements about "buying humane". Is it expensive to do so over there? is it like organic foods that end up more expensive than the chemically grown ones?

The spokesperson was saying that the humane society is tagging products that come from farms that have been certified humane, so unless the products are costly, i don't see why people wouldn't at least try to go that way.

 

[Amanda (was Aziyade)]

I realised just last night that there appears to be a serious issue with animal slaughter in the US, as i saw several advertisements about "buying humane". Is it expensive to do so over there? is it like organic foods that end up more expensive than the chemically grown ones?

Basically yes.

Because the US (not necessarily the individual people, but companies like McDonald's, etc) buy SO much meat, it is not cost-effective to buy from small farms. So what happens is we have developed "factory farms" which are HUGE feedlots with thousands of cows, squished into as small a physical space as possible. Then the animals are slaughtered en masse, with the slaughterhouse workers given ridiculous quotas on how many animals must be killed and processed in an hour. With those numbers and those speeds, abuses are rampant.

Additional problems with factory farming (that don't relate to animal abuse) are the deliberate creation of an underclass of workers who man the feedlots and slaughterhouses; human abuses to that underclass, which often consist of illegal or undocumented workers; the destruction of the economy of small farming; environmental pollution; and others.

For a decent overview on factory farming in the US you can read "Fast Food Nation" or "The Omnivore's Dilemma."

The spokesperson was saying that the humane society is tagging products that come from farms that have been certified humane, so unless the products are costly, i don't see why people wouldn't at least try to go that way.

I haven't seen that yet, but I'll bet the factory farms will challenge it, just like the factory dairies sued and prevented some farmers from advertising their milk as BGH-free. In this country, money talks, and factory farming rakes in a lot of money. At this point any farm can put "free range" on their label, and there is no governmental assurance that the farm IS actually free range. Hopefully the laws will change, but I'm not holding my breath. The cattle and beef industry pays way too much in campaign donations for me think any senator will bother to take up this cause.

 

[Yame]

The cattle and beef industry pays way too much in campaign donations for me think any senator will bother to take up this cause.

Not a Senator, but Dennis Kucinich would. Unfortunately, he is now the only Congressman (or one of the only) left who actually cares about the people, and he soon may be redistricted out.

 

[Dev]

This is from Australia.

Kids on goats - Today Tonight - Yahoo!7 News

Many people think its just entertainment. How sad.