Masked male

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Jessenia

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He has impressed me with his movements! but I believe that facial expresions are vital for manifesting his attitude and passion for the dancing.
Wearing a mask just hides that beatiful part of the performing
 

Recnadocir

New member
I have no problem with a fast/extreme routine.

I think if he were female, he'd be getting about the same amount of attention.
I don't have a problem with fast movement either; but the great dancers, whatever the dance form, move brilliantly at both very fast and very slow tempos. They can bludgeon with technical brilliance, but also touch the viewer with feather light, nuanced gestures. The essence of good choreography, on the level of the individual or solo dancer, is constrast.

I've seen many female dancers with greater movement inventory on display, better musicality, certainly much more nuanced performers. There are some in the show I'm performing in right now, the Evening of Experimental Middle Eastern Dance series. It's an education.

That's not to say I think he's a bad dancer. I've already stated he has some good skills. But the over the top, hyper, flashy, "look at me" aura turns me off. Great performers, for me, always show some vulnerability, even some humility in their dancing. Don't see it with this guy. He's trying way too hard. I'll say it again, he needs to watch Horacio, learn some softness, some subtlety.

Perhaps when Horacio says "all belly dancers should study some ballet," he's not just referring to the physical and technical benefits of ballet training. Horacio danced ballet at the highest level, and one doesn't get to that level only by being a great technician. One has to also be a great performer. And that requires nuance and vulnerability.
 

Aisha Azar

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Orgun etc

Dear Rico,
While I really don't like Horatcio's dancing, I do agree with what you said that the guy is way over the top and has no vulnerability or texture in his dance except "over the top".
I totally disagree that all belly dancers need to take ballet. They are two completely different forms of expression culturally, in the physical and in essence. Besides that both styles of dance use body movement as forms of expression, they have nothing whatsoever to do with each other.
Regards,
A'isha
 

Recnadocir

New member
Dear Rico,
I totally disagree that all belly dancers need to take ballet. They are two completely different forms of expression culturally, in the physical and in essence. Besides that both styles of dance use body movement as forms of expression, they have nothing whatsoever to do with each other.
Regards,
A'isha
First, sorry about the double post. The second one was an edit and expansion of the previous one, which somehow didn't get deleted in the edit process. Is there a moderator for this forum yet?

Second, I don't agree that all belly dancers need to take ballet either, Aisha Azar, and wasn't implying that I completely agree with Horacio. I do believe, however, that many belly dancers could improve their athleticism and their technical execution of things like turns, where they choose to include these in the choreography, and ballet can help with this, in addition to improving balance, a sense of line, and flexibility. And I don't know for sure but am speculating about Horacio's intent regarding the more subtle, performance-oriented benefits of ballet training. I will say that the two dance forms where I see the most nuance are ballet and classical Indian dance.
 

Aisha Azar

New member
Orgun, etc.

Dear Rico,
I think that belly dance creates its own sense of balance that is more appropriate to the dance than that acquired through ballet. I would say the same is true of athleticism, etc. As for choreography, many of the very best belly dancers don't even choreograph, but instead know their music inside and out, and understand how to respond to the music, as their bodies and spirits are manifesting the music on the physical plane, which is a visceral and not an intellectual process. I think this DOES require years of training in the technical area of dance, so that the body moves in response, but also within the boundaries of the families of movement that are associated with belly dance... and with the right essence, if you will.
I have never studied ballet or any western forms of dance, yet I think most people who have seen me dance would say that I do not lack in subtlety, complexity or technique. These things are inherent in the dance.
Regards,
A'isha
 
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Makeda Maysa

New member
I, too, find the mask off-putting and kept thinking, "Why?" It just seemed pointless to me. I think he has some great moves, but it seemed less like a bellydance performance and more like watching Stuart from MADTV doing bellydance moves ... "Look what I can do!"
 

Shanazel

Super Moderator
Dear Rico,
I think that belly dance creates its own sense of balance that is more appropriate to the dance than that acquired through ballet. I would say the same is true of athleticism, etc. As for choreography, many of the very best belly dancers don't even choreograph, but instead know their music inside and out, and understand how to respond to the music, as their bodies and spirits are manifesting the music on the physical plane, which is a visceral and not an intellectual process.
Regards,
A'isha
If we still had the smilie that claps, I'd put it here.
 

Jamil

New member
i have seen a few of his clips..
the mask was different. but not totally offputting. i didnt really care if he was ugly or not i just wanted to see what he could give as a male dancer.
to label him a belly dancer would be a bit streched. labelling him a damn good entertainer would be more befitting ot his image.
his prop work and flexability is amazing... his choero could be worked on a bit more, but not terrible compared to some that i have seen (unless his skit was improv then it was pretty good... but im doubting it was)

dont be too harsh on him, i didnt mind watching his performance. it was entertaining. :D
 

Aisha Azar

New member
Mask etc.

Dear Jamil,
I saw his dancing pretty much as you did. Do you have any clips out anywhere?
Regards,
A'isha
 

Rebecca_

New member
Erm, I'm not so into bellydance where the bellydancer puts his head under his knee and hops around like that... I mean I recognize that contortionism is an art, but as far as I know, it's not part of a turkish dance...
 

ShiroiOji

New member
I gotta say, I'm not big on the mask myself. It makes me think too much of Pulp Fiction.

"Where's the Gimp?"
"Gimp's sleepin'."

:lol:
 

khanjar

New member
First thoughts on reading this thread, is yes, a mask does help focus on the movement, the facial features obscured, but on watching the video, the thought was, what the hell has he got on his head, and I found I was trying to focus on the mask, to see what it was, and ignored his movement.

I am not fussed either way about masks, but if one is to be masked, please make it something interesting, what he wore I thought to be positively grotesque.
 

Jane

New member
Mask is creepy! I'm not fond of clowns either- they rank right up there with spiders. Men in bra tops are also climbing the list...

Entertainer- yes. Artist- not so much. I think the mask was part of the tension/creepy/entertainment factor.

As an aside: There seems to be way too much emphasis on technique in a lot of dance forms. Technichque is a means to an end, not the end itself. The end goal of any art dance is emotional expression. P!ssy mood bad day (sorry) will go to bed now. Better tomorrow.
 

ShiroiOji

New member
Mask is creepy! I'm not fond of clowns either- they rank right up there with spiders. Men in bra tops are also climbing the list...
GAH! I flippin' hate hate HATE clowns! They should be banished from the face of the Earth, really! My fear actually showed to one about a year ago down on Hollywood and Highland, and the freak ran after me until one of my friends got between us.

Sorry, back to the talking about the mask...
 

Jane

New member
Support group for Belly Dancers who hate clowns now open for new members :shok:

Rival group: Belly Dance Clown Fusion Dancers
 
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ShiroiOji

New member
ROFLMAO!!! Loves it! Can we do terrible things to them, like you know, setting fire to the building while they're locked inside to thus rid the world of more clowns?
 

Caroline_afifi

New member
When people do something theatrical or different with dance... or even just use a prop of some sort, I look for the way in which it is used and what is being communicated (not a story of some sort).

What was the purpose of the mask, did it fit the music or dance, was it Halloween?? WHAT WAS IT!!!
 
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