No hope

[Tarik Sultan]

As for Serkan's show

This is a public forum and participation is voluntary. No one twisted anyone's arm to write a review and so if the participants were all qualified professionals, and I think they were, then.... it was a good show. Were there technical things that might have gone wrong? Sure. Were there any participants who felt they could have done better.... of course, we always think we could have done better, but that doesn't mean that we should assume that the show wasn't good. Should there be objective reviews, of course. But even if one or two people were off their game does not mean the show was a flop and wasn't entertaining.

 

[Tarik Sultan]

Dear Khanjar:

I totally get where you're coming from about all gendered shows. If it were the case that we only had shows that were all male or all female all the time then that would be an issue, but that's not what we are talking about in this case. This is an occasional thing. And like I've said before, every other dance form has had all male shows. Ballet does it, modern does it, Flamenco does it, Tap does it, Hula does it, Hip-Hop does it. No one has as of yet addressed the issue I asked waaaaaaay back. If all of the other dance forms have done it and think nothing of it, and have suffered no ill consequences, then why is it suddenly a problem when we do it? After all, this has been happening in Europe for OVER 10 YRS by many artists.

 

[Caroline_afifi]

Dear Caroline,

I am not sure where the rest of the quote went, but I will try to respond to the whole thing.

RE punishing men: I am not sure why not wanting an all male show is considered to be punishing them.

Who are we to place restrictions on anyone when it comes to Art?

I am not into placing restrictions on people. I may argue that what they do is not art bust masturbation, and I may never hire them or recommend them but if some other mad person wants to then so be it.

To me this kind of thing enforces the already obvious problem of women treating men as if they are more special than women. I have spent my life supporting men in dance at all levels. I have sponsored men to star in 3 of my last 7 shows and teach workshops. I also have had them act and dance in other shows in the last few years, been teaching them and learning from them and working with them and sponsoring them for the last 34 years. I no longer feel good about doing that now that they are excluding women. I will make it a point not to sponsor either men or women who are supporting all male events. Maybe they could care less about my tiny little opinion, but I will not be hypocritical about it. My money is where my mouth is. This is the only power that I have in this situation.

OK and that is your choice and perfectly OK.
The problem is still about re-educating women to not conform to silly stereotypes like some of the example you mentioned.

There is a LOT of room between not doing all males shows or having a more egalitarian response to male dancers and having them march off to war. One has little to do with the other. I am not threatened by men dancing either, but I surely would not expect them get applause merely for being men, or to exclude women from dancing in their shows.

It doesnt for me. If I went into the recruitment of the army in relation to what I am saying it would become an essay. There is a connection. Men on the dance floor do not feel the need to join the army and if they want to do all male projects in dance then so be it as long as they know why they are doing it in the same way women must think about it.

I think the last point was about the pathology of many women's responses to males belly dancing going beyond screaming and yelling. It manifests in many ways. You pointed out one yourself, where the women in the audience clapped louder for the male than for the females in the show. What message does this send? That somehow, even though he may not be a better dancer, the male is superior to the females on some level, in these womens' minds.

I agree. I have echoed these sentiments many times in these discussions.

I have seen women in workshops go out of their way to get attention from the male instructor, where they do not do the same with females. I once saw a woman slide sensuously out of her belt and bend over to pick it up off the floor,all for the benefit of the male instructor. He ate it up rather than responding as if she was out of line.

So what did the other women in the class say to her? they shoulod of told her to get a grip. I believe everyone has a collective responsibility when it comes to behaviour and dealing with it.

I have seen men act like total mysogynists and women put up with it,

Perhaps it is the screamers and they enjoy it?

One male instructor tried to bully me one time. When I told him to knock it off, the women in the room acted like I was at fault. When he apologized to me after my show, he did THAT in complete privacy where no one could see him do it. This is not a problem that men are creating all by themselves, but they are usually not trying to do anything to stop it either. The all male show is one more way of setting themselves apart from us, and this leads to problems, not solutions. When women act out as if men were so much more important than women it adds to the problem but curing it is not going to happen through excluding us..

Regards,
A'isha[/QUOTE]

It is bad about you being bullied and you were right to challenge it.
The support or lack of it depends on how much the others percieved it in the same way as you. Also students like to ass lick teachers.

Men can set themselves apart as women can as they are different.
What if all their audience was Gay and they just come to scream too?

We cant say as women that we demand to access all area but tell men they cant. Do you really believe that? it seems grossly unfair to me.

PS Khanjar. From a male perspective, why do you feel against male show?
Just curious to get different perspectives on this.

 

[Aisha Azar]

Males, etc.

Dear Caroline,

RE the question, "Who are we to place restrictions on anyone when it comes to art?"

It seems to me that this question might have been better asked of those who put restrictions on women appearing on the same stage as them.


Re the problem of educating women not to conform to silly stereotypes.

Aren't you rather placing the blame 100% on females when it is actually a problem of male/female relationships? both men and women buy into the bullshit, not just women. This is an example of how we are trained to think it is "our" fault and "our" responsibility. It takes two to tango.



Re men on the dance floor not feeling the need to tote guns.

Actually I have known a couple men who have done both. One does not negate the other. There are serial killers who love ballet.


Re the woman who slid sensuously out of her belt.

I think most of the class did not witness it or pay attention. I was in the middle of talking to the male about what he wanted to teach next. My response was that they were both consenting adults and could deal with the situation as they pleased. I feel about sexual encounters between two adults just like you do about art. Who am I to be critical about it?

The statement about misogyny:

Not all women who put up with it are screamers. Some just do not know it when they see it, or know what to do in the face of it. Mistreatment of anybody can be so insidious and creep into a whole system. as in women being paid less than men for the same work, etc.

I agree. I have echoed these sentiments many times in these discussions.

Yes, you have and that is partly why your response here confuses me.

It is bad about you being bullied and you were right to challenge it.
The support or lack of it depends on how much the others percieved it in the same way as you. Also students like to ass lick teachers.

Or there a a lot of teachers out there who train their students to ass lick. It is a two way street.

Men can set themselves apart as women can as they are different.
What if all their audience was Gay and they just come to scream too?

Thus far we have not had to deal with it. I try not to create problems where none exist, but to address the current problems.

We cant say as women that we demand to access all area but tell men they cant. Do you really believe that? it seems grossly unfair to me.

You are not talking to one of those women who believes that males and females need equal access to everything in the world. You are also not talking to someone who believes men should banned from dance, are you? So I am not sure what your question is here or what you think I am saying that is "grossly unfair". I have made it abundantly clear that I support male dancers. What I do not support is all male shows. Do you not see the difference?
Regards,
A'isha

 

[Tarik Sultan]

Dear Caroline:

There's something here you mentioned that I think a lot of people are missing. There were two male dancers in the show, yet only one got that kind of response. Why didn't people treat Shafik that way?

There is a lot more going on here. Another question, would those women have reacted differently if if were a male Hula dancer in a loin cloth, (a totally legitimate costume in their style)? Could it be that Ozgun sent a message that Shafik didn't in the way he presented himself on stage and that these women, because they live in a society which tells them that if you are over a certain age, you are not allowed to be sexual, show sexual interest or be the initiator, use this as an excuse/opportunity to rebel express the fact that they are sexual beings who can take initiative and decide who they want or don't not just be objects who sit passively waiting for someone to show them attention?

I think that there are many things going on here and what I'm reading confirms it. I don't think its so simple as men thinking they are entitled and getting attention they don't deserve.

 

[Tarik Sultan]

Ah, but those Beatlemaniacs, etc, were girls, not middle-aged women who appear never to have seen a man before. I have to wonder what happened to the dignity and self-respect of grown women who bellow like animals at male dancers.

Okay, but you see, I think this is the problem right here. ACT YOUR AGE. Honestly, what positive messages are mature women given about sexuality? You're washed up over the hill dried up. At the exact time when women are reaching their sexual peaks, society is telling them, the game's over for you grandma. I think that mature women who act out like this are really rebelling against this mentality, maybe its even subliminal.

I remember I was hired to do a birthday party for a woman. It was her 50th. The whole time she kept screaming "I'm 50yrs OLD WHHOOOOO!!!" She was acting wild and crazy and all the things we've just described. But when i looked in her eyes, I saw it wasn't genuine. She wasn't excited and thrilled to be 50, she was devastated! Why? Because in our culture if you are a woman, that means game over. Thank god that women are now beginning to challenge this notion, but I fear many women do not know how to do this in a self empowering way because they were never given the tools to do so. So how do they do it? By acting like they were 18 or 20, dressing in styles that are way too young for them, (not that they have to dress in sack cloth, but you know what I mean), drinking too much, burning the candle at both ends, why? Because they are trying in their way to say, "I'm still here, I still got it, I'm still relevant". This I believe is one of the issues at the heart of this situation. The screaming and whatnot is not a thing in and of itself, but a symptom of a deeper state of mind.

For the record, I never could understand why those young girls acted the way they did over Elvis or the Beatles and I see it everywhere. Talent shows where the guys aren't that great, dance shows of all types. I think we have to look deeper as to what is going on in society and the way it treats women and the messages it gives women to cure it. You don't kill a weed by wacking away at leaves, you have to pull out the roots.

 

[khanjar]

PS Khanjar. From a male perspective, why do you feel against male show?
Just curious to get different perspectives on this.

Perhaps it is that I misunderstood what was going on in this thread, but I am not against all male or all female shows if it is an occasional thing. What I am against is a situation where separate gender shows become the norm, or at least appearing that they are becoming the norm. As that to me, is a step backwards in time when we should as humanity, be moving forward.

 

[jenc]

If you want to know I am SOMETIMES TURNING INTO A DIRTY OLD WOMAN. It might have something to do with living with a tired old man!!!. I have found BD as an outlet for the unwanted energy that I have, but I am starting to feel old age at my shoulder, so occassionaly I drool over the young squaddies running past in vest and shorts. I'm not only not going to get any, I'm not even permitted to want to.

 

[khanjar]

Okay, but you see, I think this is the problem right here. ACT YOUR AGE. Honestly, what positive messages are mature women given about sexuality? You're washed up over the hill dried up. At the exact time when women are reaching their sexual peaks, society is telling them, the game's over for you grandma. I think that mature women who act out like this are really rebelling against this mentality, maybe its even subliminal.

I remember I was hired to do a birthday party for a woman. It was her 50th. The whole time she kept screaming "I'm 50yrs OLD WHHOOOOO!!!" She was acting wild and crazy and all the things we've just described. But when i looked in her eyes, I saw it wasn't genuine. She wasn't excited and thrilled to be 50, she was devastated! Why? Because in our culture if you are a woman, that means game over. Thank god that women are now beginning to challenge this notion, but I fear many women do not know how to do this in a self empowering way because they were never given the tools to do so. So how do they do it? By acting like they were 18 or 20, dressing in styles that are way too young for them, (not that they have to dress in sack cloth, but you know what I mean), drinking too much, burning the candle at both ends, why? Because they are trying in their way to say, "I'm still here, I still got it, I'm still relevant". This I believe is one of the issues at the heart of this situation. The screaming and whatnot is not a thing in and of itself, but a symptom of a deeper state of mind.

For the record, I never could understand why those young girls acted the way they did over Elvis or the Beatles and I see it everywhere. Talent shows where the guys aren't that great, dance shows of all types. I think we have to look deeper as to what is going on in society and the way it treats women and the messages it gives women to cure it. You don't kill a weed by wacking away at leaves, you have to pull out the roots.

Yes Tarik, you are I think correct, there is something deeper going for not so young women to act in this way. Perhaps it is the society our present one is built on, a society which created a rot which is self perpetuating and indelible in our modern existence. Like dry rot, one has to find the fruiting body to kill something which causes so much damage.

Here, in my country, though we are a good century away from the Victorian period, much of it's ideals still exist, a Victorian mentality which was in it's time a two faced society, and what have we now, the very same.

 

[khanjar]

If you want to know I am SOMETIMES TURNING INTO A DIRTY OLD WOMAN. It might have something to do with living with a tired old man!!!. I have found BD as an outlet for the unwanted energy that I have, but I am starting to feel old age at my shoulder, so occassionaly I drool over the young squaddies running past in vest and shorts. I'm not only not going to get any, I'm not even permitted to want to.

See, that is what's wrong, you refer to yourself as 'dirty', when in fact you are no dirtier than younger people. Dirty old man, dirty old woman, how often do you hear dirty young woman or dirty young man ? Because ages creep up, it does not mean someone should stop being what they are, a human just like the next human. If you are still feeling the pull, you're not past it.

 

[Tarik Sultan]

Perhaps it is that I misunderstood what was going on in this thread, but I am not against all male or all female shows if it is an occasional thing. What I am against is a situation where separate gender shows become the norm, or at least appearing that they are becoming the norm. As that to me, is a step backwards in time when we should as humanity, be moving forward.

Exactly. If it ever gets to the point where a man can ONLY dance in an all male show then count me out. Such a situation would not be helping male dancers but limiting them. As with other dance form, the occasional thing is fine. Making it a MUST DO is something different. Its like in the past Afro Americans chose to socialize with each other because of various reasons, but Jim Crow Laws forcing them to be separate at all times was completely different. The main thing was in one situation people had free will and choice, in the other, they had no choice, they were forced.

 

[Tarik Sultan]

See, that is what's wrong, you refer to yourself as 'dirty', when in fact you are no dirtier than younger people. Dirty old man, dirty old woman, how often do you hear dirty young woman or dirty young man ? Because ages creep up, it does not mean someone should stop being what they are, a human just like the next human. If you are still feeling the pull, you're not past it.

Dear Jenc:

I second Khanjar. This is exactly what I mean. BEcause you have reached a certain age society wants to make believe you no longer have a sex drive. You have to make believe and go along with the bullshit or else you get labeled DIRTY, for having natural biological and psychological responses. In other words you are being penalized for being ALIVE! This is what aging becomes in our society a slow sanctioned march to self imposed/conformed death. First they take away your sexuality, then they take away you beauty, then they take away your mobility, then your agency, then rights to an opinion or self determination till they shut you up in a home and wait for you to die. I think in many ways women are saying SCREW THAT or at least are deeply resentful of the mentality but don't know how to fight back and so, at times it spills out in such behavior. I think if women, young and old were truly valued by society and thought to live lives that were meaningful and fulfilling at every age, there would be far less of this sort of acting out.

I think its good that we discuss this sort of thing so that we get to the root of the problem and can begin to make meaningful changes in our lives and in society as a whole!

 

[Caroline_afifi]

Dear Caroline,

RE the question, "Who are we to place restrictions on anyone when it comes to art?"

It seems to me that this question might have been better asked of those who put restrictions on women appearing on the same stage as them.

The issue is that men are already excluded from classes and all female shows etc. To only allow them to grace a stage in the presence of women whom permit it does sound restrictive.

Re the problem of educating women not to conform to silly stereotypes.

Aren't you rather placing the blame 100% on females when it is actually a problem of male/female relationships? both men and women buy into the bullshit, not just women. This is an example of how we are trained to think it is "our" fault and "our" responsibility. It takes two to tango.

I place the blame on individual and collective responsibility. No one can get me to scream if I dont want to. Has society not preogressed at all in the last 50 years? An active audience moved by a performance is fine and dandy but shrieking at someone just because they are the opposite sex is just beyond me.

Re men on the dance floor not feeling the need to tote guns.

Actually I have known a couple men who have done both. One does not negate the other. There are serial killers who love ballet.

I dont do that but for someone like me who has studied social education, dance and other forms of art are the best tools we have as a society for personal development and tackling anti-social behaviour. It is too long to go into honestly.


Re the woman who slid sensuously out of her belt.

I think most of the class did not witness it or pay attention. I was in the middle of talking to the male about what he wanted to teach next. My response was that they were both consenting adults and could deal with the situation as they pleased. I feel about sexual encounters between two adults just like you do about art. Who am I to be critical about it?

We are allowed to have expectations when it comes to profesional conduct.

The statement about misogyny:

Not all women who put up with it are screamers. Some just do not know it when they see it, or know what to do in the face of it. Mistreatment of anybody can be so insidious and creep into a whole system. as in women being paid less than men for the same work, etc.

True




Yes, you have and that is partly why your response here confuses me.

Or there a a lot of teachers out there who train their students to ass lick. It is a two way street.

This is not teaching, it is brainwashing and a form of control. No teacher on the planet can make me ass lick but there are lots of vulnerable people who enter this dance and I hear of these power plays all of the time and it makes me sick.

Thus far we have not had to deal with it. I try not to create problems where none exist, but to address the current problems.



You are not talking to one of those women who believes that males and females need equal access to everything in the world. You are also not talking to someone who believes men should banned from dance, are you? So I am not sure what your question is here or what you think I am saying that is "grossly unfair". I have made it abundantly clear that I support male dancers. What I do not support is all male shows. Do you not see the difference?
Regards,
A'isha

I do see the difference but I dont agree. The very nature of this dance means that your average man will always have a fear of it for all the reasons discussed a million times. It is highly unlikely we will ever see equal numbers.
The very nature of this dance means for me that the men whom choose to take part with so much judgement stacked against them from Men and women derserve at least a little compassion. If you are asked to be in a show, do you ask if it is all inclusive?
We have enough to deal with with all the rubbish which is often passed as belly dance without making good male dancers are enemies.

 

[Caroline_afifi]

Dear Caroline:

There's something here you mentioned that I think a lot of people are missing. There were two male dancers in the show, yet only one got that kind of response. Why didn't people treat Shafik that way?

He didnt remove any clothing and he was fully covered. He is still a good looking guy and a great dancer.

Ozgen was more of a 'show man' and had a lot of tricks and amazing technique. I think some were genuinely amazed at his performance but it was not so different from Leyla Jouvana in ability. She too got a great reception but minus the tension I think. Interesting what Zorba said about the 'hush' signal. I didnt realise it was common!

There is a lot more going on here. Another question, would those women have reacted differently if if were a male Hula dancer in a loin cloth, (a totally legitimate costume in their style)? Could it be that Ozgun sent a message that Shafik didn't in the way he presented himself on stage and that these women, because they live in a society which tells them that if you are over a certain age, you are not allowed to be sexual, show sexual interest or be the initiator, use this as an excuse/opportunity to rebel express the fact that they are sexual beings who can take initiative and decide who they want or don't not just be objects who sit passively waiting for someone to show them attention?

I think I am perhaps a snob to these sexual outbursts. I dont feel repressed in this way so I have no idea what it is like to watch a male dancer and lose it. I am not sure it is an age thing though? older women are often very sophisticated about how they flirt and express themselves sexually and I admire this alot.



I think that there are many things going on here and what I'm reading confirms it. I don't think its so simple as men thinking they are entitled and getting attention they don't deserve.

No. I think some just believe they are fantastic in the way some female dancers do, if enough people tell you then you believe it. People get good at blocking out the critics and label them as something else.
If men get a huge reaction then why wouldnt they think they were the best thing since Elvis. Men are sensitive and vulnerable and are human beings too.
Experience is the greatest thing that all people have and experience tells us when people are slavering or genuinely enjoyed it. We have to become wise and real in our own assesment of what is good. Those who dont are what I refer to as masturbators as they generally dont care as long as they are performing and have an audience.

 

[Aisha Azar]

Males, etc.

Dear Caroline,

The issue is that men are already excluded from classes and all female shows etc. To only allow them to grace a stage in the presence of women whom permit it does sound restrictive.

At least that is the myth. I have seen men in classes and teaching classes for as long as I have been dancing. One of my first teachers was a man. Men have worked in every type of venue that I have worked in for as long as I have been dancing. I do intend to be restrictive now, but I believe the trend was started by the people who started the all male show and not by me. I am restrictive in response and not doing anything they are not doing, but you point a finger at me instead of them. Nice.

I place the blame on individual and collective responsibility. No one can get me to scream if I dont want to. Has society not preogressed at all in the last 50 years? An active audience moved by a performance is fine and dandy but shrieking at someone just because they are the opposite sex is just beyond me.

The fault lies in training that has happened over eons and is not going to go away just because a few intelligent women do not do it. As long as men respond to it, or as long as women do, depending on the circumstances, then it will continue. Men often act the same way with the "take it off baby" nonsense. Often it is not even anything at all to do with the performer and has much more to do with the people that the screamers are associating with.

dance and other forms of art are the best tools we have as a society for p
I dont do that but for someone like me who has studied social education, ersonal development and tackling anti-social behaviour. It is too long to go into honestly.

Having studied sociology, psychology, etc. ( Working in a university for 7 years had its pay offs!!) I can tell you much of our behaviors are hard wired in. War certainly seems to be. No society is free from violence and I feel that art is not the key to changing that since some art actually enhances violent feelings. I feel that making it known to children from the time they are babies that human beings have violent feelings but that they can choose every day not to act on them is one of the main keys in changing behaviors. A few male dancers doing a show without females does not help to end violence, nor does a few males dancing do anything to improve the situation.

Re the woman who slid sensuously out of her belt.
We are allowed to have expectations when it comes to profesional conduct.

But clearly this kind of thing happens no matter what our expectations are. I would also expect that women would not whoop and holler at male dancers, but there you are. Next time you are in a room full of them, tell them to stop.

I do see the difference but I dont agree. The very nature of this dance means that your average man will always have a fear of it for all the reasons discussed a million times

.

Oddly enough, when I have discussed "the very nature of this dance" I have been told I am full of it.

It is highly unlikely we will ever see equal numbers. The very nature of this dance means for me that the men whom choose to take part with so much judgement stacked against them from Men and women derserve at least a little compassion. If you are asked to be in a show, do you ask if it is all inclusive?

Is any man in this dance choosing not to be there? They know all of this going in, just as women know the down side of the dance for themselves. There is nothing stacked against males or females that they should not be prepared for if they choose to indulge in this activity. Among dancers, males are pretty much well accepted. I can name one exception Men can't dance in a few clubs? So what? Neither can I. They seem to be doing fine in every other area of dance.
I do not ask if it is all inclusive, because as you point out, the numbers are not set up for every show to have an equal number of men and women, or even any men at all. In the past I tended to include men in my shows more than most, putting my money where my mouth was in support of them. I will not be doing so any more since men are now excluding women. Why should I not act the same way they are? What is the difference? There is none.

We have enough to deal with with all the rubbish which is often passed as belly dance without making good male dancers are enemies.

[/QUOTE]

And what do you think the difference will be when the dance is overrun with testosterone because of men and women who refuse to accept the "very nature of the dance"? Taking the long view, it will be the same kind of problem that the rubbish which is currently passed off as belly dance is causing.

The fact that a lot of people scream their heads off for ANY male dancer does not encourage me to think that people necessarily know there is a difference between a good male dancer and a bad one.

You know, this is getting to be a round robin argument, so I am done. If no one wants to look at this in any light except how much men should do whatever they want because they have not had a fair shake, then I really can't change anyone's mind or make them see the bigger picture. It seems to me that a lot of women are buying into a mythology that the men have it rougher than we do when it is not really true. But I can guarantee that more shows are on the way in which women will be excluded. This is not a one time thing.
Regards,
A'isha

 

[PrinceKayammer]

Dear middle aged women of this forum,if anyone want to say anything about as and our show can say it.but we are not "a few male bellydancers"...we have names so if you want to say something say it in our face!

 

[Male Belly Dancer SERKAN]

And I have enough of this talking!!!
Why always you???Why other or we don't have a problem???Only you are making problem of this???
ASP to me!!You called me Sexist!!!Like I'm enemy of woman!!
I always organize shows all this years with female dancers.I never but never against to female dancers.Always I love to dance ,share stage with female dancers.I love female dancers (good dancers ofcourse!!!)maybe you are scary about this but good dancers sould be never scary about this!!Because they will be always welcome in show/dance life!!!

And again 'm saying I have enough of reading your posts about Male dancers against to female's!!(Even without using our name.But Everybody know we are organizing Male show!!People in this forum is not stupid.They know you are talking about who!!)

This is not WAR!!!!!You want to start one war.Don't provokate nobody!!!!!

Just Lets DANCE!!!!!!!!!!

without looking to SEX!!!

 

[Suheir]

US dancer JimBoz is being hosted in the UK this summer. Here's an extract from the flyer for one of his forthcoming appearances here: "At last year's International Bellydance Congress everyone was talking about one dancer from the US. Jim Boz. He took the place by storm and when he danced the crowd went wild!"

Now, did the crowd "go wild" because he was the most amazing Oriental dancer anyone had ever seen, or was it because he's a big, muscly man? :think:

No disrespect to JimBoz, from the clips I've seen he's a very competent and entertaining performer and I've read glowing reviews of his workshops. However, I wonder why Fahtiem, a more experienced dancer from the US, who also appeared at the Belly Dance Congress, wasn't invited back instead?

 

[Aisha Azar]

Males

And I have enough of this talking!!!
Why always you???Why other or we don't have a problem???Only you are making problem of this???
ASP to me!!You called me Sexist!!!Like I'm enemy of woman!!
I always organize shows all this years with female dancers.I never but never against to female dancers.Always I love to dance ,share stage with female dancers.I love female dancers (good dancers ofcourse!!!)maybe you are scary about this but good dancers sould be never scary about this!!Because they will be always welcome in show/dance life!!!

And again 'm saying I have enough of reading your posts about Male dancers against to female's!!(Even without using our name.But Everybody know we are organizing Male show!!People in this forum is not stupid.They know you are talking about who!!)

This is not WAR!!!!!You want to start one war.Don't provokate nobody!!!!!

Just Lets DANCE!!!!!!!!!!

without looking to SEX!!!

And I would suggest the same to YOU since YOU are the one who made a show based on gender in the first place, not me.
If you are threatening me in some way with that statement about "Don't provokate nobody", I would back off if I were you.

 

[Male Belly Dancer SERKAN]

I Think you will be never understand right???
I try to talk to you gentel way but You never listen or you have a problem to understand.
You can think about what you want.But I'll not play your game.I HAVE ENOUGH OF YOUR WAY OF THINKING!! I told you I never,ever against to female dancers.I give you all this explanations but you never understand.
Continue your way.
Good bless you!!!or what ever!!