Politics and dance.

Nejmeh

New member
How many times have you come across such a situation, where politics seem to interfer with the dance or the dancers? Either in your personal life or in general.

Or is the main experience dance overcomes those differences in politics?

A good friend of mine once got rejected on a event for her decent(?), right here in Holland. In those words.:rolleyes:
The first thing she did was organise something else where co-operation side by side was the main thing!
 

Pleasant dancer

New member
How many times have you come across such a situation, where politics seem to interfer with the dance or the dancers? Either in your personal life or in general.

Or is the main experience dance overcomes those differences in politics?

A good friend of mine once got rejected on a event for her decent(?), right here in Holland. In those words.:rolleyes:
The first thing she did was organise something else where co-operation side by side was the main thing!
Nejmeh - do you mean descent i.e. from whom you are descended, your ancestors, relatives, etc?

I think there are laws against that! Sounds pretty unacceptable, whatever the context.
 

Eshta

New member
Hey Nejmeh,

Zeg het maar in het nederlaands, volgens mij was iets verloren in het vertaalen...!
 

Greek Bonfire

Well-known member
How many times have you come across such a situation, where politics seem to interfer with the dance or the dancers? Either in your personal life or in general.

Or is the main experience dance overcomes those differences in politics?

A good friend of mine once got rejected on a event for her decent(?), right here in Holland. In those words.:rolleyes:
The first thing she did was organise something else where co-operation side by side was the main thing!
Do you mean my personal political views or do you mean where students have to kiss-up to the teacher or the teacher has to play up to a student with connections?

As far as my personal life goes, if I had to do over, I wouldn't tell quite a few people that I bellydance because no matter what, they refuse to be educated on what the Dance really is all about, and usually look at me like I do something indecent.
 

Nejmeh

New member
Ok, first of all, I need to download a spelling check!

:confused:I knew something didn`t add up. Descend, where your family is from. She is certainly decent:lol:

Eshta: you translated or do you speak dutch?

Greek bonfire: Actually both are interesting. I was thinking of world politics but this is equally disturbing sometimes!
 

Greek Bonfire

Well-known member
Ok, first of all, I need to download a spelling check!

:confused:I knew something didn`t add up. Descend, where your family is from. She is certainly decent:lol:

Eshta: you translated or do you speak dutch?

Greek bonfire: Actually both are interesting. I was thinking of world politics but this is equally disturbing sometimes!
If I ever changed my day job, I would probably not tell them that I bellydance. I work in law and they are pretty conservative. The firm that I am working at now is not too bad, in fact, quite a few people have come to see me perform, including my boss. They have mixed feelings on it but mostly think it's fun (while they blush lol!). But it's a pretty small place, and so not much room for office politics. However, at other firms I know this would be held against me, even though they would never come outright and say so, it would be viewed with narrow-mindedness. Trust me, I know how this business works :rolleyes:
 

LadyLoba

New member
That is true Greek Bonfire...I used to have a friend....the one that turned all mean...but he was mean over an unrelated issue. Anyway..he is a lawyer, and he liked Belly Dancing a lot....but everyone else who worked in his building would have had a fit if they had seen belly dancing or heard someone talking about doing it.
 

Mosaic

Super Moderator
I have never had politics interfere in my life when it comes to dance. If it has reared its ugly head I haven't noticed because I would just ignore/not even bother noticing it & be an ostrich - bury my head in the sand and continue doing what I love as BD causes no physical hurt or pain to others and if by watching someone dance they are inclined to have a heart attack, then please go and have it elsewhere.
~Mosaic
 

Shakti

New member
If someone was rejected on the basis of race or ethnicity in the bellydance world that is really not cool. And if I was that dancer I would not hide the incedent. Discrimination is worse than any random snarkynes or B****ness I have ever heard of. Just curious- what race in Holland would this bizzarre individual have a problem with? I visited Amsterdam and found it to be a very racially mixed place and a very progressive place. If the truth were known -this jerk probably has some underlying mental issues that need to be addressed.

I have met many Europeans and there are race issues in each different country. Which I found surprising.

My finding is that ppl in the bellydance world,those who do play politics usually find themselves without any friends and few students. I know a dancer who was shunned into moving and have sponsors cancel their seminars. Karma....
 
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Nejmeh

New member
Sorry for the absence, been busy preparing my performance tonight! I`ll answer the rest tomorrow!

If someone was rejected on the basis of race or ethnicity in the bellydance world that is really not cool. And if I was that dancer I would not hide the incedent. Discrimination is worse than any random snarkynes or B****ness I have ever heard of. Just curious- what race in Holland would this bizzarre individual have a problem with? I visited Amsterdam and found it to be a very racially mixed place and a very progressive place. If the truth were known -this jerk probably has some underlying mental issues that need to be addressed.

I have met many Europeans and there are race issues in each different country. Which I found surprising.

My finding is that ppl in the bellydance world,those who do play politics usually find themselves without any friends and few students. I know a dancer who was shunned into moving and have sponsors cancel their seminars. Karma....
Well, for holland being tolerant, that was once upon a time unfortunately. When I grew up there where little narrow minded people, now holland has a serious racist core. We have a political party that says muslims are ignorant, stupid, the Koran is the same as Mein Kampf, they are a great danger for our society and more of that bla. Last year we had big race riots between Maroccan youth and Indonesian youth. The races that are mainly targeted are all that belong to muslim countries.
 

Greek Bonfire

Well-known member
I have met many Europeans and there are race issues in each different country. Which I found surprising.
Unfortunately, this kind of thinking has been going on across the world since the beginning of the human race, which goes to show that we haven't come as far as we should. :rolleyes:
 

Chani

New member
Would it be problematic if the hirer wanted somebody of Middle Eastern descent? Just wondering out loud really as I am not sure how I feel about this myself. I'm Anglo but I can see that somebody might request a dancer that was Middle Eastern or at least looked like they could be ME as opposed to a very fair person. Not because they think of look is better than the other in general but belly dance is a ME dance and it might be that they want the dancer to look like the "real deal". Might this be a reasonable request?

Perhaps the OP can explain more about the specifics.
 

Greek Bonfire

Well-known member
Would it be problematic if the hirer wanted somebody of Middle Eastern descent? Just wondering out loud really as I am not sure how I feel about this myself. I'm Anglo but I can see that somebody might request a dancer that was Middle Eastern or at least looked like they could be ME as opposed to a very fair person. Not because they think of look is better than the other in general but belly dance is a ME dance and it might be that they want the dancer to look like the "real deal". Might this be a reasonable request?

Perhaps the OP can explain more about the specifics.
Makes a lot of sense. I am not ME but I have some Mediterranean roots. I look like an ME-Medit mix so for me, this has worked as a blessing and a curse as far as bellydancing goes.
 

Eshta

New member
I think we often overlook the fact that belly dance is an aesthetic art - yes we are there on skill but our appearance is also a huge part of it.

When movies, tv shows, theatre productions etc are auditioning for parts, ability is important but so are looks, age, ethnicity. Belly dance is no different. My best friend is Iranian, I was blond, now gone dark, but very clearly of pasty white Brit origin. She gets turned down for dance gigs because she looks arab (and passes them on to me), and I get turned down for dance gigs because I don't look arab (not as much with the dark hair though!) and pass them on to her. I don't see this as racism, any more than I would do see as racist a preference for chocolate or vanilla ice cream...?
 

Chani

New member
What about non racial physical traits? I am offended if a bigger girl is passed over for a slim dancer but don't think I would be if it went the other way. I find long hair more "in keeping" with the typical image of a belly dancer so would understand if a short haired dancer was passed over for one with long hair.

I suppose I am most offended when an untalented dancer is passed over for a talented dancer due to physical appearance but when the skill is equal I don't blame the hirer for going with the dancer they prefer based on appearance whatever that preference is.

This thread has made me realise I have double standards I didn't know I had.
 

Nejmeh

New member
Would it be problematic if the hirer wanted somebody of Middle Eastern descent? Just wondering out loud really as I am not sure how I feel about this myself. I'm Anglo but I can see that somebody might request a dancer that was Middle Eastern or at least looked like they could be ME as opposed to a very fair person. Not because they think of look is better than the other in general but belly dance is a ME dance and it might be that they want the dancer to look like the "real deal". Might this be a reasonable request?

Perhaps the OP can explain more about the specifics.
I`d rather not go into specifics of the case I was thinking off because its really specific and a bit too personal. To be a bit more general, it was a case of total ignorance and for us, we just didn`t expect this coming from the bd-scene. Perhaps that was a bit naive, but somehow we both felt this didn`t belong/fit. If you get my drift...:think:

But I think the point you raised is very valid. A good friend of mine keeps being amazed that most dancers on our school haven`t got any arab decent or specific fascination prior to the dance.
 
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