Turkish Belly dance
- Thread starter khanjar
- Start date
Roshanna
New member
I'm no expert (I've taken a few workshops in Turkish style but nothing more), but Turkish style tends to be more fast, energetic, showy and extroverted. More moves with an 'outwards' energy like hip lifts. The arms seem more complicated to me. Lots of floorwork and zill playing. Sometimes some Romany influenced moves. There's a separate Turkish Romany dance, but a lot of the bellydancers are Roma too.
The obvious person to look for classes with to learn Turkish style in the UK is Ozgen. He's brilliant, and one of my favourite teachers even though I mainly do Egyptian style.
The obvious person to look for classes with to learn Turkish style in the UK is Ozgen. He's brilliant, and one of my favourite teachers even though I mainly do Egyptian style.
nitewindz
New member
Both styles are shaped by the local cultures. The Rom, Greek and Balklan influence Turkish dance. The Saidi, Ghawazee and Bedouin influence Egyptian dance. Egyptian dance is shaped by rules put in place by King Farouk in the early 1950's. These rules banned floor work and required dancers to cover their stomachs. Even today in Egypt dancers must follow guidelines, such as starting a hip circle from the side or back but never the front, or risk loosing their license and the right to dance.
Egyptian dance is internalized and controlled. There's a saying that a good Egyptian dancer can dance on a postcard. Precision is emphasized.
Turkish dance is more lively and covers a lot more ground. Isolations are still important and sloppiness is still sloppiness, but Turkish dancers place less emphasis on precise isolation. Turkish dance is not bound by Egyptian rules, so Turkish dance often includes floor work and the costumes feature bare bellies.
When Westerners keep time, they may tap their foot or clap their hands. Turkish dancers often keep time with quick, sharp pelvic tucks. Egyptian dance uses tucks, but not the repetitious, rhythmic "time-keeping" pelvic tucks.
Egyptian dance rarely uses props. Dancers often do a cane dance to a Saidi rhythm, Ghawazee dancers may perform folkloric dances with long sticks. An Egyptian cabaret dancer may enter with her veil flowing softly behind her, and she may swirl it a few times before discarding it. Egyptian dancers are forbidden to remove clothing or coverings on stage, it's too close to stripping for Egyptian comfort. So Egyptian dance never includes elaborate veil work.
Turkish dance uses more props than Egyptian dance, but it's not as prop-crazy as American belly dance. Turkish dancers do beautiful veil work, and dance with swords, canes and candles.
Turkish dancers often play zills, and play for most of their set. Egyptian dancers may perform part of a song with zills, making a big deal about putting them on and playing them. In Egypt, it was considered a status symbol for a dancer to be wealthy enough to pay a musician to play zills, so even tho dancers learn to play, it's rare to see them play during a performance. The Ghawazee, on the other hand, play a steady zill rhythm during folkloric dances.
Turkish dance uses rhythms like the Greek Chifit-telli or the syncopated 9/8 Karsilama. Egyptian dance doesn't use either rhythm, instead, they use Saidi (cane) and Felahin (farmer) rhythms.
Artemis Mourat and Eva Cernik are fabulous Turkish style dancers. Artemis has a great dvd out. I don't think Eva has a dvd but she may offer video lessons. Ruby's Totally Turkish and Sarah Skinners I Love Turkish are also good.
Love Ozgen, if you get a chance to study with him, go for it. Turkish style is very important in the roots of American stye belly dance, vintage cabaret styles are very similar to Turkish, with high energy, big movements, zills, floor work, props, etc. Love it. I love Egyptian, too, but my heart was first conquered by the vintage American style and I still love it the most, I think. Turkish belly dance music is awesome, too, closer to the freedom of American jazz. Egyptian music seems more formal.
Here is a classic performance by Tulay Karaca, she is Rom and uses some elements of that in her dance, but also Oryantal:
[video=youtube_share;kzOpNqu3VYo]http://youtu.be/kzOpNqu3VYo[/video]
Here is a classic performance by Tulay Karaca, she is Rom and uses some elements of that in her dance, but also Oryantal:
[video=youtube_share;kzOpNqu3VYo]http://youtu.be/kzOpNqu3VYo[/video]
khanjar
New member
The above video, what comes across is that Turkish style has a heightened sense of freedom, its wilder and yes more jazz like, more arrogant and less coy and so wonder is the differences between the Turkish people and the Arab world is reflected in their differing dance styles ?
Kashmir
New member
I'd put it that the Egyptian people influence Egyptian dance - this includes Sa`iidi, Bedouin and Fellahi peoples - in all their variety. I think the Ghawazee have had a much smaller influence on Egyptian dance as they are fairly recent. Being in Africa, there is more emphasis on hip movment. Turkish dance is also influenced by the Turks - who came from east Asia (the Turks' culture was widely adopted by the people they ruled - but apparently there was little genetic merging).
Although professional Egyptian dance has been modified by the post-1952 revolution, the underlying dance - as seen in the social dance - is still very different from Turkish. More hips. More isolation. More about the music than show off.
Duvet
Member
There don't seem to be many hard and fast rules between the two dance styles. There are blurry bits around the edges, that sometimes mean, from the experience I've had, that I can only identify the dance style because of the costume and music, particularly with some of the Egyptian Modern styles.
Turkish style tends to be more energetic, fast and furious. It can involve floor work and more back bends. The energy is up and out - as in hip lifts and travelling on tiptoes. It also tends to be more 'in the face', directing the energy out at the audience (look at what I can do!).
Egyptian is more reserved and internal. The energy is downwards and inwards (hip drops, more flat footed), and there is no floor work. It tends to pull the audience into the dancers energy, rather then pushing it out to the audience (look at what I want to show you).
That's what my teachers have shown me, but as I said, other than the music and costume cues, there's not a real hard a fast rule, just a general feeling. My first teacher was Turkish style (she is not teaching at the moment), but I find the majority of teachers I meet today have an Egyptian style background. Turkish Cabaret seems to have gone out of fashion around here, but Turkish Rom style is gaining ground as a novelty. Many teachers don't state which dance style they are teaching, claim to teach across styles, or label it 'folkloric', which could be just about anything!
Ozgen (London), teaches Turkish, as does Sacha (Bristol), Caitlyn (Oxford), and Deniz (Southend). There will be others, but I can only think of these at the moment. Ozgen does workshops around the country, so he might come to your area sometime. This - Bellydance Teachers - Geographic Listing of teachers of belly dance classes in the UK and internationally - lists some UK bellydance teachers, but it will be a little out of date and you have to check each entry for 'style' individually.
Turkish style tends to be more energetic, fast and furious. It can involve floor work and more back bends. The energy is up and out - as in hip lifts and travelling on tiptoes. It also tends to be more 'in the face', directing the energy out at the audience (look at what I can do!).
Egyptian is more reserved and internal. The energy is downwards and inwards (hip drops, more flat footed), and there is no floor work. It tends to pull the audience into the dancers energy, rather then pushing it out to the audience (look at what I want to show you).
That's what my teachers have shown me, but as I said, other than the music and costume cues, there's not a real hard a fast rule, just a general feeling. My first teacher was Turkish style (she is not teaching at the moment), but I find the majority of teachers I meet today have an Egyptian style background. Turkish Cabaret seems to have gone out of fashion around here, but Turkish Rom style is gaining ground as a novelty. Many teachers don't state which dance style they are teaching, claim to teach across styles, or label it 'folkloric', which could be just about anything!
Ozgen (London), teaches Turkish, as does Sacha (Bristol), Caitlyn (Oxford), and Deniz (Southend). There will be others, but I can only think of these at the moment. Ozgen does workshops around the country, so he might come to your area sometime. This - Bellydance Teachers - Geographic Listing of teachers of belly dance classes in the UK and internationally - lists some UK bellydance teachers, but it will be a little out of date and you have to check each entry for 'style' individually.
Last edited:
Ariadne
Well-known member
Sarah Skinners I Love Turkish is not actually Turkish dancing. It is however a good instructional video on skirt dancing. I cannot recommend Artemis and Ruby's DVD's enough, they are excellent.
Jane
New member
Roshanna
New member
Caitlyn was one of my first teachers, and her style is actually more classic American than anything. This does mean she uses some Turkish music, plays zills and does lots of veil and floorwork though, so still a rarity in the UK
She's also studied Turkish Romany dance in some depth.
BeatriceC
Member
Aylin Hansen would be the other UK (London based) teacher I'd recommend for learning authentic Turkish style.
Rakkase | Belly Dance Classes in London and Essex
Rakkase | Belly Dance Classes in London and Essex
khanjar
New member
And so, I have started Turkish style workshops at last with a very fit and spectacular native teacher, I am impressed, I like this where part of me is thinking it's perhaps what I need in that it's very extrovert but boy I ache long after the workshops as this style very much demands more and seems to find new muscles to challenge where recently it was the control of abs, all four of them, where abs drive other movement, it coming from the core, where I can only find two at the moment let alone independently control this four that are in there somewhere. But yeah they are there somewhere, hence the coin trick.
But I am hoping to continue with both styles as Turkish I already recognise is fantastic training for Egyptian style in terms of strength and control of muscles, it is to me anyway, a hefty work out where my judge is how much water I drink where with Turkish I drain a litre where it is half that with Egyptian.
But I am hoping to continue with both styles as Turkish I already recognise is fantastic training for Egyptian style in terms of strength and control of muscles, it is to me anyway, a hefty work out where my judge is how much water I drink where with Turkish I drain a litre where it is half that with Egyptian.