Have anyone seen the movie "Belly Dancers of Cairo"... Just shocking!
What do you girls and guys think? Many dancers working as prostitutes after the shows.... etc.... I am soooo sad.......
Dear Reen,
........ You seem rather shocked by this. Is it new information to you? This kind of thing has been going on since before belly dance even existed. I suggest you read Gustav Flaubert's book of his travels in Egypt. Also, as someone pointed out, it has also been traditionally true in the U.S. that many entertainers earned a better living if they were also prostitutes. This tradition actually carries on today in he form of the "casting couch" !
Regards,
A'isha
^^^
you sound disillusioned. it is an art, it is up to us to have it respected as such.
no matter what societal mores might want to impose on dance.
Gosh its not about the DANCE!
Dance is PERFECT!!!!
As a person outside the cultures of origin, you have that view of it. I love the dance and so do some, though not all of the dancers in countries of origin. to some it is, as stated in Von Nieukirk's book, "A Trade like any other". But they do not kid themselves that it is an uplifted and lofty minded dance form, either. They understand and accept the sexual connotations and they accept them. Even Lucy in her interview with National Geographic some years ago stated that. When asked about being a Muslimah and dancing she did not say it was a lovely, nonsexual dance from. she instead said that "God is forgiving".
It is how it is represented in Egypt, and how many people get disillusioned when it is too late?
And if we get disillusioned it says less about the culture and dance of Egypt and more about how we often do not want to look at the whole truth of the dance, but are in a position of luxury where we can pick and choose what appeals to us. (Though I would hope that we would instead really LOOK at the entire picture on the cultural level and make our decisions based on that. Remember also that rich dancers are in a way better position than poor ones and most of us would qualify as rich in comparison to the poor there.
I mean you never see that on internet, I suppese everyone who worked in Egypt just keeps it quiet?
I have seen a lot of sleazy videaos coming out fo the Middle East, and I have not thought of this side of things as hidden. Reen, I think it is just new to you, and still pretty painful....
I understand it sucks to say that's it is the reality there.... But also many girls dream to work in Egypt not knowing what it is like.... and Others are just too scared to lose their business trading , etc with Egypt so they also keep quiet?
Well, I think the video that is the subject of this thread proves that they do not keep it quiet. It has been out for some time and is only one example of the publicizing of these issues.
And I suppose in the West one can get single mom child allowance, or medical help... and well bare nessesities are denied there...
Many of the women here can not qualify for help either.... My daughter is one example of a single mom who can not get her medical needs met, for example.
But THAT is not the point.... but that lack of information??????
I have not noticed any lack of information. I have been aware of these things since shortly after I started dancing.
And I am truely saddened that the "creators" of the dance really make disgrace out of it....![]()
Gosh its not about the DANCE!
Dance is PERFECT!!!!
It is how it is represented in Egypt, and how many people get disillusioned when it is too late? I mean you never see that on internet, I suppese everyone who worked in Egypt just keeps it quiet?
I understand it sucks to say that's it is the reality there.... But also many girls dream to work in Egypt not knowing what it is like.... and Others are just too scared to lose their business trading , etc with Egypt so they also keep quiet?
And I suppose in the West one can get single mom child allowance, or medical help... and well bare nessesities are denied there...
But THAT is not the point.... but that lack of information??????
And I am truely saddened that the "creators" of the dance really make disgrace out of it....![]()
I was reading through this thread and it made me think that, yes, it often seems confusing or shocking to new (and not so new) students, who are told, by and large, that 'the dance' has had a long position of social enjoyment by and for the people... and is not the seduction harem fantasy it has been made out to be in the west (so true!). It is an art form, that's the western mantra, used to repel the stereotypes (used it myself a time or two!). Then along come some of the realities of dancing for pay in... Egypt for example... that 'tarnish' the precious ideal of Oriental dance, the art form.
And/or how many times have 'we' seen a video of a Shaabi wedding dance performance and it's bump and grind in a hot pink micro mini? Or a picture of a Turkish dancer in a barely there costume, ass cheeks a showin? It runs contrary to what we are taught as students, naturally, people feel an impulse to say that's not right, she's ruining it with the tarty outfit and loose behavior, it's not real dancing or whatever. I have to admit that at one point I came through a bit of this judgment myself! And then got over it. It is part and parcel and that's the reality. That doesn't mean I don't have a preference, if the choice is watching the latter or Sema, it's gonna be Sema. I'm interested in the art of it rather than the more ends-to-a-means type dancer (though this is illuminating too!).
IMO, If prostitution did not occur AT ALL with Oriental dancers I don't think it would really change anything toward making it an acceptable occupation for daughters, wives etc. It would still be an immodest profession.
I'm not trying to liken Oriental dance and stripping to each other but for the sake of relatability... In the US, if you strip, you're considered fallen right? You probably smoke, drink, maybe get high, have sex partners, maybe even hook and/or associate with people who do. Even if none of those things occurred in the exotic dance industry the profession itself would be way outside of what society considers a respectable profession. Of course that doesn't deter a zillion different types of men (and women) from patronizing strip joints. It wouldn't change one's social standing in regards to their job.
Thank you Salome for your post! I feel better now.... Cos I see that I am not the only one...
Lydia, it is good that you can tell us about these things with your experience and years you lived in Middle East. I do also feel it is important that new dancers are educated, because it is dangerous! We all know about the human trafficing, but of course many people do not know WHAT the dance scene in the ME like.
They think they gonna go and dance there and gain experience, and then the dreams break horribly.
I did not mean that someone is 'hiding' the info, but of course those that get abused and have terrible experiences are not likely just to tell everyone, but just say, oh I worked in Egypt for 2 years, had great time and I mean why say I worked in some cheap and sleazy place etc....
I am sure I am not the only one who has "illusions". I thought it had to do JUST with the position of women, and her "public exposure", but the bitter truth is that dance and sex industry are mingled in the ME....
An average student thinks of 'Belly dancer' as say Ansuya in tasetful pretty bedlah rather than a shaabi dancer in some sleazy outfit... ????
You guys who have experience and have travelled etc know better.... but for the rest of us all is left is either live illusion, or maybe have it broken in a painful way....
Are there any sites that talk of reality of dancing in the ME? Like for dancers contemplating work in ME? I was wondering... Can we have a sticky thread somewhere? I wonder if anyone would want to contribute... cos we see now and then posts about work in ME....
I dunno.....
/Cut
So Ren, don't give up hope. Its because of people like you that our dance will find the respect that it deserves. Who knows when things will change in the Middle East, but you know what? We are all creating something much greater than the dirty minds and desires of the heartless and soulless pariahs who seek to make something ugly out of every beautiful gift the creator gives mankind. Be aware of the depths to which the human soul can sink, but always let the love in your heart and the gift that is this dance, keep your ship high afloat.
All good up to this point ... sound like the white Tarzan is coming to the jungle to make every thing right.
You'r black I am :shok: :shok:, I did not notice my friend.Well... I'm black.