Just a belly dancing fan

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DreamHunter

Banned
Hi all. I'm just another belly dancing fan. I simply admire the grace, beauty, artistry & natural spontaneity of belly dancing & belly dancers. Including those dances/dancers from diverse places around the world, which seem to be like kind of related to conventional/traditional belly dancing, which as far as I understand it, is mostly native to & rooted in the West Asian region, especially the Arabic parts of it, judging by the musical beats, melodies & instruments.
 
Farasha Hanem

Farasha Hanem

New member
Welcome to the forum, DreamHunter. Traditional bellydance comes from the MENAT (Middle East, North Africa, and Turkey). It is rooted in countries such as Egypt, Lebanon, Iraq, and even Greece. Hope you like it here. :D
 
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DreamHunter

Banned
Farasha Hanem said:
Welcome to the forum, DreamHunter. Traditional bellydance comes from the MENAT (Middle East, North Africa, and Turkey). It is rooted in countries such as Egypt, Lebanon, Iraq, and even Greece. Hope you like it here. :D
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Thank you, Farasha Hanem. First time I've come across the abbreviation 'MENAT'. I guess it kind of means approximately the same thing as the term Levant, which is more familiar to me.

Just to engage in some nitpicking, the expression 'Middle East' is like a bit position-dependent, so it's really only geographically correct for someone in, say, UK or France, but not for someone, in, say, Pakistan or India. It was an expression that came into being during the time of the old British Empire, I guess.

I'm not a dancer, Farasha. Can't dance to save my life, got stiff legs, LOL. But I like to watch a dance. A bit like someone who likes to watch football (soccer), but can't play it.
 
Shanazel

Shanazel

Moderator
Middle East works just fine for those in Asia... you just have to go a bit further to get far enough east. :)

Welcome, by the way.
 
Kashmir

Kashmir

New member
DreamHunter said:
Just to engage in some nitpicking, the expression 'Middle East' is like a bit position-dependent, so it's really only geographically correct for someone in, say, UK or France, but not for someone, in, say, Pakistan or India. It was an expression that came into being during the time of the old British Empire, I guess.
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There are lots of words and phrases which can look odd when you parse them word at a time "razed to the ground", "hand over fist" etc. "Middle East" has a meaning from Europe which arose during WWI. The "Far East" is India and China. "East" referred to Central and Eastern Europe (any thing east of Paris :) ) The Middle East is western Asia - which actually DOES include Turkey (sometimes even Greece) so MENAT is redunant - MENA covers the birth countries of the dance.

The Levant does not include Egypt, by the way. But Egypt (and usually Libya) is part of the Middle East. However, Algera, Tunisia, and Morocco are not. Dance styles there are related - and often studied by "belly dancers" - but have no direct influence into raqs sharqi which is the performance style underlying most western belly dance.
 
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DreamHunter

Banned
How old do you think West Asian belly dancing is, Kashmir? ... I was saying, just guessing, that it - or an ancestor of it - has very ancient origins ... like as old as ancient Egypt or ancient Mesopotamia ...

I cud even picture Semiramis getting herself into the court, & subsequently the heart, of her husband, the Nimrod of the time, on the strength of her prowess as a belly dancer ... And maybe Roxanne won Alexander's love that way too ...

But someone (was it Shanazel or Farasha?) said belly dancing is only around 150 years old ...

Let's hear your thoughts ...
 
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Kashmir

Kashmir

New member
Belly Dance as "a dance of seduction" is very modern - this myth of belly dance is Western European. Victorians could not image people "moving like that" unless it was about sex - nor could they image men or children dancing in that way - which is its roots. A folk dance used to celebrate. Due to the segregated nature of Egyptian society women do not as a rule dance in front of men. If you want to see dances of seduction - look at the Berber line and circle dances. Done in mixed groups with lots of leaping and jumping - a way for both sexes to judge the fitness of potential mates - but hardly "sexy" by western standards.

As I see it the roots of belly dance combine African movement with Arabic music, so we are looking at hundreds rather than thousands of years. Sure, people before that may have used hips and torso movements – but belly dance is more than the movements (Salsa and Hula use hips but are not “belly dance”). Unfortunately it was so commonplace we have little written evidence of dances before the 19[SUP]th[/SUP] century. To complicate matters Western travellers were men whose only interaction with women tended to be prostitutes.

We do have some images on tombs – but analysis (“Ancient Egyptian Dances” by Irena Lexová) suggest they were nothing like belly dance; more like acrobatics.

Finally, many people limited “belly dance” to describe the staged, professional version of the folk dance (still danced today at parties and with friends). This version of the dance only goes back to the 19[SUP]th[/SUP] century.

So depending on your definition I’d say anywhere between 200-1300 years old.
 
Zorba

Zorba

"The Veiled Male"
The Shikhatt and the dances of the Ouled Nail come to mind - and neither is Belly Dance.
 
D

DreamHunter

Banned
I wud reckon it to be even earlier, Kashmir, logically speaking ... Becos it was not that dificult to do & organise, well at the most basic level ... All one needed was a functioning drum of some sort, the most rudimentary of flutes, someone who cud sing, someone who liked to dance, and a happy celebrative mood all around ... Then, pronto, one has a fiesta ...
 
Kashmir

Kashmir

New member
A fiesta is not belly dance - and drum is the lesser part of the music. It is not just any old dance with hips - it is a specific response to a specific style of music.
 
Farasha Hanem

Farasha Hanem

New member
Kashmir said:
A fiesta is not belly dance - and drum is the lesser part of the music. It is not just any old dance with hips - it is a specific response to a specific style of music.
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This. Plus, bellydance, unless a person was raised up in the culture, IS more difficult than a person not brought up in that culture realizes. As Kashmir pointed out, "it is not just any old dance with hips."
 
Harry

Harry

Member
BTW, I don't think anybody else mentioned it: I've learned, around here, there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a belly dancing fan. I, for one, defend anybody's right to be here, be they dancer or a fan. Think about it, if there weren't any fans, the dancers might not have anybody to perform for, except themselves! So, let the party begin! :dance::clap:
 
D

DreamHunter

Banned
Right on, man ...

I'll hv to second that ...

You've hit it smack bang right on the head, dude ... Couldn't hv put it any better ...

And, like in any sport or game, fans should be free to judge for themselves what type or category of player they would like to like ...

Like, if we take football (soccer) as an example, some prefer a purely technically skilful player, like Lionel Messi, others like someone with a bit of flash, like David Beckham, while yet others want a player with both, like Cristiano Ronaldo ...

There ya go ...
 
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Shanazel

Shanazel

Moderator
No one objects to fans or admirers until they become intrusive, insulting, and/or display such levels of prurient interest that the performers become uncomfortable.

To quote Aretha:
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
Find out what it means to me
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
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