Racism, prejudice and terminology (Bad News: EGYPT spinoff)

[gypsy8522]

It drives my DH absolutely that the boxes to check are usually Black, White or Hispanic. Uh, Hispanic means Spanish speaking and you can be any race and be Hispanic. People are always commenting "You're Cuban, but you're white."

And you can be any race and be Arab. But it doesn't surprize me to see ignorance coming from such a system. But hey, at least it's got "White" and "Black" right . It will probably take another 25- 50 years to figure out what Hispanic is.

 

[Aniseteph]

Amnesty aren't saying the statistics on race shouldn't be recorded, are they?! The cops are not pulling people over because their records say they are black...

I still don't see any reason behind asking for someone's race on an application form other than limiting human acheivement and making marginalized people feel more inferior than they already are.

I suspect for most public sector organisations in the UK you are asked that information confidentially and most definitely OFF the application form. Anyone asking for it on a form that the interviewer or shortlister sees would be would be asking for trouble here. I don't think they are even allowed to ask if you are married these days.

Where I work they collect race info on patients too, to "see if there are differences in access to services between racial groups, investigate the underlying reasons for any differences, and address any areas where there appears to be unfairness, disadvantaged or possible discrimination."

It is not perfect but it is done with the aim of making things better. Without monitoring you can't prove there's a problem (even if it is blindingly obvious that there is - some people won't want to face it), you can't get resources allocated to try to put it right, and you can't see if any changes you make are working.

(hey, this has kept me from going and ranting pointlessly on the latest burlesque belly thread, which has to be good )

 

[da Sage]

Racial fairness may be a real moral principle NOW, but it wasn't 50 years ago in the South of US where black people were horrendously treated by their white 'masters'. Since morality wasn't invented over the turn of the century, I personally don't agree with that.

Some people (even 50 years old in the South of the USA) had moral principles regarding racial fairness. Some people didn't, and still don't...even in California, New York, and Maine. I don't think black people called white people "Master" 50 years ago, either...even in the South.

While laws change and religous texts that were once interpreted a certain way are "re-adjusted" to fit, there are certain things rooted in the cultural mentality of people that remain strong and preserved. This holds true the world over.

Really? Can I quote you on this, later?

Jena Six - Profile of the Jena Six Trials

This is a really upsetting story. Unjust persecution like this is why I'm a member of the ACLU.

Yes, racial data might not be collected in banking where it's needed. Why collect such info when it will be used for the reasons you mentioned, ie for the advantage of "coloured" people? I still don't see any reason behind asking for someone's race on an application form other than limiting human acheivement and making marginalized people feel more inferior than they already are.

Actually, it was an ill-considered idea to suggest collecting racial data in banking. But as someone who used to be in banking, I would often service 3rd-party loans where a car dealership would get a cut of the loan interest every month. This is a percentage the dealership added to the "real" interest rate the customer qualified for, because they thought they would get away with it. Many of these loans, and the ones with the largest margins (biggest cut going to the dealership), were to people I considered "black". Iwas and am angry on their behalf, but clearly my half-baked idea about taking racial data is not a good way to police the practice of gouging black people on interest rates.

And don't get me started either on racial profiling. Denying young military people car loans for not having enough credit is NOT the same thing as denying a group of people loans or jobs and humiliating them based on their race. The latter, according to Amnesty International, is a violation of human rights. Racial Profiling.

Sorry for going off on the tangent, it has only confused matters. I'm just saying these young service-people are getting taken advantage of in a similar manner as black borrowers I was talking about - but in this case, they're being sold used cars, probably for more than book value, at ridiculous interest rates. And I'm angry because the US government is partnering in this program, when they should be protecting their soldiers' financial interests, instead.

I can wait a few years until I'm a little older to get a car loan, but changing my skin color is not in my hands (I'm not Michael Jackson) and I am not going to change my name and religion either just in order to please others because they have a problem with it. *cough* Obama. Oh, please don't think I'm blaming the man for literally bending down on his knees and swearing to God that he was never anything but a Christian. If anything, it just proves he's a smart man. He knew there is no way on earth he could be president of the United States unless he did that. I mean if being black is a disgrace by itself and it could make him lose, he wouldn't want to add "Muslim" to the mix.

Oh no, not that can of worms! While I sincerely doubt Obama was ever a committed Muslim (if he was in fact a Muslim at all during his childhood), it's pretty clear that he's been a devout Christian for 20+ years.

 

[Mosaic]

Great read and some great points from everybody. I certainly get a bit more educated on the subject.

I remember the first time I heard the english term "Caucasian". I was baffled! I had NO idea that some people considered me caucasian and that I had to tick that box. (I was twelve and going to live in Canada with my family.) I certainly did not feel caucasian as that for me indicated people living in Caucasus, and still do.

I agree with Gisela, a great read, and also the term caucasian, that is just plain weird, as is European for white people, anywhere in the world. I was born and raised in NZ far from Europe and the caucasus's (sp), so I am neither caucasian or European, I am a New Zealander or 'Kiwi' of Irish, Spanish, swedish and Polynesian descent. I trace my lineage back to the first human who happened to be what is now known as African in bone structure, and from these first humans came all branches of the human genome. So what colour is my skin, it is pale-ish in winter and quite olive in summer. My husband is Malaysian Chinese, my children vary in shades of brown to pale, as my Mum says we are a world of nations family, as many other cultures are also part of the family, Puerto Rican, Jamaican, Indian, Maori, and Greek. We never speak in terms of colour, only in terms of culture and countries of birth.

I just don't get the terms that one is black or Australian Aboringine if somewhere you can trace an ancestor who was of those origins. The world today is a melting pot, I doubt that there are many people in the world who can say their family line is purley of one origin, and all of us can say we are we are black/white/asian etc, because somewhere we will find that ancestor who hailed from some other culture.

Anyway It seems if we wish to be 'true' to our origins we should all call ourselves African, to honour the first humans our ancient ancestors

My Grandmother always use to say, "You can call me anything you like - but just don't call me late for dinner" - a double meaning, which as kids we didn't get but thought it was really funny to call her "late for Dinner".

For our family at least people were people first, of whatever origin second, never a colour.

Nature provided pigmentation so humans could survive in the climates they were born into, and that is such a marvellous and perfect little miracle. Nature is truly wonderous, and humanity should accept that for it is.

Anyway I have digressed a little I am enjoying the perspectives of your all.
~Mosaic

 

[da Sage]

And you can be any race and be Arab. But it doesn't surprize me to see ignorance coming from such a system. But hey, at least it's got "White" and "Black" right . It will probably take another 25- 50 years to figure out what Hispanic is.

Once an Egyptian man struck up a (rather one-sided) conversation with me in an on-campus coffee shop. First of all, he wanted me to know that Jesus was in the Koran, and exacted a promise from me to read it. Then, he insisted that he was white, that all Arabs were white, not black (I was not contradicting him, but he behaved as though I was). This is all completely out of left field - these were the only two topics he spoke on (although he might have asked me if I was a student, first, to open the conversation.) I'm not really sure what he wanted, but that was one of the stranger "stranger" encounters of my life.:shok:

And according the US census, "Hispanic" is someone with any Spanish, Portuguese, or Latin American ancestry (I think...). It's the new black!

 

[Nat242]

I apologise for going a bit off topic here.
Dear Aisha,
It is true Aboriginal people went through the hell period when “white “ people used to shoot them. In Tasmania they killed every one of them except one lady, Like killing the Dingo or the bush Turkey. But the last 30 years was a different story, The Government and Private bodies are doing their best to push them financially and setting School and colleges in remote areas. Discrimination im sure still happens and widespread, but I will tell you the truth, In Australia if you are an aboriginal you can be far better off and have a good start in life than other Australian races. We even have a joke, if you are a minority race, gay and have one leg you can count yourself as a prime minister to be.

<snip>

I'm sorry, WHAT? Do you really think that Indigenous Australians have some advantage over non-Indigenous Australians? Look at their infant mortality rate. Look at their rate of higher education. Look at their lifespan. Look at their health. Look at their poverty. Look at the racism that still exists (what happened to Aunty Delmae is a horrifying example). Look at the overwhelming lack of education in our schools about the culture of Indigenous Australians, about the stolen generation, about the massacres.

And tell me, if your last line was true (I know it's a bit of a joke), but why are there so few minorities, homosexuals, and one-legged members of parliament? Do we live in the same country? Our parliament is overwhelming filled with white, able-bodied, heterosexual, christian men. Not a lot of diversity there.

Australia has it's own racism issues...what about the Cronulla riots of 2005?

I'm sorry if I've derailed the thread, but I just had to respond to this post. Indigenous Australians face overwhelming disadvantage. We've made a little progress since the change of government, but there's a long way to go to close the gap.

 

[da Sage]

How odd! The Australian woman I sat next to on the plane said there was no racial, ethnic, or immigrant tension whatsoever in Australia!

I suppose some people only see it in "other" countries and cultures...not their own.

 

[Nat242]

How odd! The Australian woman I sat next to on the plane said there was no racial, ethnic, or immigrant tension whatsoever in Australia!

I suppose some people only see it in "other" countries and cultures...not their own.

Well, what that woman told you is not quite right. The place where I grew up was very multicultural, and there was very little tension. People didn't stick to racial groups; my friends used to invite me to join in with their various cultural celebrations and practices, it was great! There are places in Australia that are wonderfully diverse and peaceful.

Other places in Australia are less multicultural, more segregated, and more racist. We've had politicians in office with incredibly racist, anti-immigration platforms. We (as a country) have shown an appalling lack of sympathy to refugees in the past, which has resulted in many deaths.

 

[Mosaic]

I'm sorry, WHAT? Do you really think that Indigenous Australians have some advantage over non-Indigenous Australians? Look at their infant mortality rate. Look at their rate of higher education. Look at their lifespan. Look at their health. Look at their poverty. Look at the racism that still exists (what happened to Aunty Delmae is a horrifying example). Look at the overwhelming lack of education in our schools about the culture of Indigenous Australians, about the stolen generation, about the massacres.

And tell me, if your last line was true (I know it's a bit of a joke), but why are there so few minorities, homosexuals, and one-legged members of parliament? Do we live in the same country? Our parliament is overwhelming filled with white, able-bodied, heterosexual, christian men. Not a lot of diversity there.

Australia has it's own racism issues...what about the Cronulla riots of 2005?

I'm sorry if I've derailed the thread, but I just had to respond to this post. Indigenous Australians face overwhelming disadvantage. We've made a little progress since the change of government, but there's a long way to go to close the gap.

The way I saw the Cronulla riots of 05, ( just my personal opinion) was a whole lot of young hot heads, that took things too the nth degree, each accusing the other of racism, so it got totally out of hand and out of proportion, both sides needed to have their heads banged together.

Anyone with any type of racist attitude, no matter how big or small, should be automatically made to attend history lessons dating back to the first humans. maybe if history at that depth was an absolute must for every single child in every single country around the world more understanding and tolerance could be the outcome?

The Aboriginal people of Australia were given a very raw deal for many years, but I do think that Australia is trying, they can't undo what was done, but they can make it better. The indigenious Aussies also have to be prepared to work to better their lives. I don't think anybody no matter what their race, colour or creed should expect things to be handed out on a silver platter. Only by everyone being prepared to put aside predjudices etc can improvements be made. Every single one of us has the ability to improve our lot in some way, each generation does this for the mostpart, but you do get those people from all cultures, who just sit around and bemoan the fact that XY & Z are better off, and cry poor me! no one does anything for me etc. Well I am sorry I do not consider governments are there to hand out everything to those who don't try or don't even want to try. I also acknowledge there are people who work damn hard and strive to better their lot and it just doesn't happen. But I am mainly talking about the first world economies here and people who live in those countries have opportunities if they seek and are prepared to work and change their lot in life.

But having said all the above -I doubt there is a country in the world that can say they are racist free, some countries are just better than others at trying to stamp it out (or maybe even hiding it).

Tolerance and acceptance starts in the immediate family of every child, without that, intolerance of others whether it is race or creed etc will never be stamped out.
~Mosaic

 

[Tarik Sultan]

And you can be any race and be Arab. But it doesn't surprize me to see ignorance coming from such a system. But hey, at least it's got "White" and "Black" right . It will probably take another 25- 50 years to figure out what Hispanic is.

Not according to the U.S government. You could be as black as shoe leather, if you're from an Arabic speaking country then you're white. And if we're talking about Ancient Egyptians it gets just as crazy. Then they try to move heaven and earth to tell you that somehow Egypt isn't a part of Africa, no they weren't Africans, they were Hametic. A mystery race of "caucasians" in Africa. Then they turn logic upside down even further by telling us that this Hametic race includes Somalis and Ethiopians, but lest we think they are Africans too we are told that they are dark skinned members of the white race. Yet in America you can have blond hair down to your ass and blue eyes and still be a negro.



Is there any surprise that I so thoroughly hate this system?

THEN as if it weren't bad enough treating me like I'm a contaminating agent, they tell me that I have to do it to myself so that they can "help me". Oh really??!! This is how they try to help me.



I watched as this happened to my neighborhood in the Bronx. My mother was the first non white person to move into the building she lives in now. Before you knew it all the whites started moving out. Then the banks moved out, then the businesses moved out. The landlords couldn't get loans to maintain the buildings anymore and so they had to rent to the worse elements in society. Many of whom were alcoholics, drug users, broken families, etc. They couldn't make money on the buildings anymore. They were a financial liability and so they started setting the buildings on fire in hopes of collecting the insurance. This was in the 70's when the Bronx was burning. The first in my neighborhood was across the street. It was a massive building that took up on whole city block. It went up like a match stick! Then the buildings on the next block started burning one after the other. There were entire blocks where every single building was burned out and abandoned. I won't even go into what was happening in the schools. So when they tell me this bullshit that they're trying to help me..... Mister if that is help, do me a favor, DON'T HELP ME!

 

[Nat242]

<snip>

The Aboriginal people of Australia were given a very raw deal for many years, but I do think that Australia is trying, they can't undo what was done, but they can make it better. The indigenious Aussies also have to be prepared to work to better their lives. I don't think anybody no matter what their race, colour or creed should expect things to be handed out on a silver platter. Only by everyone being prepared to put aside predjudices etc can improvements be made. Every single one of us has the ability to improve our lot in some way, each generation does this for the mostpart, but you do get those people from all cultures, who just sit around and bemoan the fact that XY & Z are better off, and cry poor me! no one does anything for me etc. Well I am sorry I do not consider governments are there to hand out everything to those who don't try or don't even want to try. I also acknowledge there are people who work damn hard and strive to better their lot and it just doesn't happen. But I am mainly talking about the first world economies here and people who live in those countries have opportunities if they seek and are prepared to work and change their lot in life.

<snip>

Trying to understand here, correct me if I'm wrong, but you seem to be saying that Indigenous Australians have had a raw deal, but now they just need to pull themselves together and work harder? That they're getting things handed to them on silver platters? (What "things" by the way? Certainly not an equal chance of surviving infancy). When you say people "don't even want to try", are you applying that to Indigenous Australians?

I come across this attitude a lot; that Indigenous Australians should all just get to work and get over the genocide of their people and the decimation of their culture. That the government gives them so much money, it must just be because they're lazy that things are so bad for them...well, the thing is, money is not going to resolve anything. Getting jobs (assimilation) isn't going to resolve anything.

I'm glad we've apologised, that was a good day for this country, but we still have this attitude of throwing money at Indigenous Australians and leaving it at that. Gross inequalities still exist not because Indigenous Australians are not "working to better their lives", but perhaps because money is insufficient, more things are needed. If you think Indigenous Australians have been receiving things on silver platters, lots of handouts etc., I suggest you research the history and true nature of Native Title in Australia.

 

[Pirika Repun]

I watched as this happened to my neighborhood in the Bronx. My mother was the first non white person to move into the building she lives in now. Before you knew it all the whites started moving out. Then the banks moved out, then the businesses moved out. The landlords couldn't get loans to maintain the buildings anymore and so they had to rent to the worse elements in society. Many of whom were alcoholics, drug users, broken families, etc. They couldn't make money on the buildings anymore. They were a financial liability and so they started setting the buildings on fire in hopes of collecting the insurance. This was in the 70's when the Bronx was burning. The first in my neighborhood was across the street. It was a massive building that took up on whole city block. It went up like a match stick! Then the buildings on the next block started burning one after the other. There were entire blocks where every single building was burned out and abandoned. I won't even go into what was happening in the schools. So when they tell me this bullshit that they're trying to help me..... Mister if that is help, do me a favor, DON'T HELP ME!

Now opposite things happen to my neighborhood. when I moved in to part of Brooklyn, NY 4 years ago it was predominantly Caribbean and American black, and some Mexicans. You rarely see White people around here. However, especially since last year, I see more white people in my hood. Even I was the only non black minority in the apartment, and no whites live in this apartment when I moved in 4 years ago, now many residents moved out and more white people moved in the building. When I moved in this apartment, Guyana guy was the owner of the building, and he was really nice guy. However, he couldn't keep this building, so he sold to Jewish guy. He couldn't keep up so he sold to other Jewish real estate company to this building. Now my apartment is owned by Jewish company and I'm not sure how much % of rent they will rise up next year when my rent is up. One thing is sure that rent will up, but never goes down and more and more hard for minority people to live close in the city. I don't know if I can sty in here next year when owner up the rent. White people take over minority neighborhood and we are push out. Yeah, white people can find cheap rent in our neighborhood, but we minority can't find cheap place anymore, because as soon as white people move in no longer minority area anymore.

 

[jenc]

Now opposite things happen to my neighborhood. when I moved in to part of Brooklyn, NY 4 years ago it was predominantly Caribbean and American black, and some Mexicans. You rarely see White people around here. However, especially since last year, I see more white people in my hood. Even I was the only non black minority in the apartment, and no whites live in this apartment when I moved in 4 years ago, now many residents moved out and more white people moved in the building. When I moved in this apartment, Guyana guy was the owner of the building, and he was really nice guy. However, he couldn't keep this building, so he sold to Jewish guy. He couldn't keep up so he sold to other Jewish real estate company to this building. Now my apartment is owned by Jewish company and I'm not sure how much % of rent they will rise up next year when my rent is up. One thing is sure that rent will up, but never goes down and more and more hard for minority people to live close in the city. I don't know if I can sty in here next year when owner up the rent. White people take over minority neighborhood and we are push out. Yeah, white people can find cheap rent in our neighborhood, but we minority can't find cheap place anymore, because as soon as white people move in no longer minority area anymore.

I hope the fact that these people are Jewish doesn't mean anything to you. I mean you don't buy into stereotype of grasping Jews. Any nationality could shaft you just the same!

 

[karena]

Unfortunately, data and numbers are not used as evidence and they do not prove anything.

Amnesty International is not a governmental organization, it does not have access to records or enough evidence to prove racial profiling is happening. And that's why they are not able to take any action until now. Out of all the people who have been racially profiled, very few had the courage to speak up and filed charges, and just look at the number of lawsuits that have been dismissed. While you have one side insisting that racial profiling exists, the other more powerful side insists that it doesn't.

I just don't see how continuing to group people as a race (rather than human beings) is going to create fairness. The sad part is when racial info is collected, it is done for all the wrong reasons. Do you seriously believe that a White police officer in the US is going to "get arrested" for racially profiling a non-White person whom he thinks looks suspicous and criminal like? Arrested by whom? The fact is that Black people do get arrested more, twice the rate for lesser offenses. Is that enough evidence to penalize officers for discrimination? Apparently not.

OK, I can't comment on the USA, but here in the UK we have the freedom of information act which means yes these figures can be accessed, by me, let alone Amnesty. Aside from that, I think these figures are published as I hear about them pretty often. They are used to challenge the police about institutional racism eg http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/sep/18/drugsandalcohol.ukcrime. If these figures didn't exist, this article wouldn't exist, and people would be complaining and not being heard. If the figures didn't exist, how would you know that twice as many black people are arrested? "The system" likes numbers.

I'm not saying things are rosy, or that I am a big advocate of this data collection (I can see both sides of it), but how can things be irradicated unless there is evidence to back people up?

 

[Caroline_afifi]

I think these issues really are different depending on where you live.
The gay rights movement fought hard to have sexuality questions added to the registration forms in the youth centre. Of course we get a variety of unusual and jokey comments back. If you say you are something like Lesbian and you are male, then no one gives a shit here as they are totally used to it.
The people who process these documents are admin workers who dont give a shit and any percieved joke ones go in the bin.

Our city is based on 'formula' funding and these sheets are checked and used in political arguemnts in relation to funding distribution. I know because I have been at both ends of the process and have used it many times to obtain funding. The Asda/Walmart Superstore by my house has to have a certain ratio of Black workers because of the Ratio of Black people living within the area. mY youth centre has targets, the police has targets.

The Fire Brigade sent out letters to everyone in the Toxteth area of Liverpool to recruit for the fire service and Black people only were allowed to apply.
If it was not for the ticking of these boxes in my city then it maybe a very different picture.

 

[lizaj]

Both times I did jury service in the last few years in Liverpool it was notable how few faces were not white. The first time a girl of Chinese origin, the second a Chinese lad and one mxed race girl.And we are talking a couple of hundred people here. It is so important to get people to fill those bloody electoral registration forms in . It's no use the black lad in the dock screaming that he's being tried by people who don't understand him ( yes we heard it) but did HE fill in that form?
OK so you think all politians are **** but that form means you are part of the community and you don't just get to vote you get to give your neighbours a fair hearing in court.
Jurors are from all walks of life these days and we discussed our lives in our different areas of Merseyside and our different life experiences:from vicars to barrow boys but they need representatives of the racial make-up of our city in those courtrooms.

 

[Dev]

Hello Nat

I did mention discrimination happens and is widespread. But we do have one of the least problematic multicultural societies . I have lived in a few different countries other than Australia, I was born in India so I have some idea what racism means. If you have a look at Amnesty’s yearly reports and see where Australia stands in human rights. From my personal experience I have never faced any discrimination because of my skin colour, and no I have not filled up a form either where I have to answer about my colour. (I have been called a black bastard by a “white” shop lifter once whom I caught stealing from my shop, if that counts)

Racism has a much broader meaning than just “white” calling “black“ and vice versa, it’s a power thing, a tradition to keep people physiologically repressed , and many people from all colours, shape and societies experience some kind of racism in their life, I know one “Caucasian” couple who came to Australia as 10 pound immigrants, According to them they faced immense pressure and insults from the local “white Aussies” when they first arrived in South Australia.

The Aboriginal people in Australia survived what we can call cultural genocide by European people. it’s a very bad past and nothing anybody can do to erase it from the history, but as we all move on for the better future they have to move on with the society, even with their deepest pain . To be heard they have to be socially and economically powerful in the society and I think all the opportunity is there, they just have to grab it and the motivation has to come from within the society.

What is your opinion about it, what can be done to improve Aboriginal peoples life in Australia ?

 

[khanjar]

One instance of this 'fair' representation of the different colours that I saw was when I was working my final few days in the armed forces. What happened was there was a back Corporal, who had been in the service over twenty years, he was quitting too. When he put in his resignation, that somewhere rang alarm bells, for instantly he was asked not to resign, and as an incentive, they would give him his Sargent stripes. He asked why in the last ten years of his service was he not good enough to receive his stripes, but on leaving they suddenly seem to be there. That answer was the service did not have it's correct quota of black senior NCOs. So this Corporal once hearing this, said basically to stick it, as he wants to receive promotion based upon his leadership qualities, not his colour, what he said he was experiencing there was reverse discrimination based upon colour and to accept such a position because of colour would just cause a racism issue, where there was none before.

I worked in a servicing bay, where my direct superior was this black Corporal, and the Sargent in charge of all the Corporals was also black. A servicing bay that consisted of mostly white people, and I will admit, there was jovial banter between the colours, things even an outsider would call racist, but we gave just as bad as we got and what came out of it was a camaraderie where each was able to trust each other with their life if need be, our often racist banter, ironed out the prejudices where they existed, we understood each other's point of view. I think it perhaps helped that it was the ethnic minorities that were in the positions of power over the white majority.

 

[khanjar]

I always wonder about this, if there is so much prejudice against black people, why is it people that are not black, like to dress in black clothing. Look in any high street in any UK town, notice what is the most dominant colour of clothing worn by people.

 

[kayshier]

I've read this thread.
2 things stand out, even in the discussion about racism and profiling, there were classifications and terms that were used that typically i find offensive. but its social conditioning so it can be excused to a point.
racism and theories with regard to racial classifications were intended to create just what is happening in this thread, a lot of talk about divisions, confusing classifications and labels that we put on each other.


but i want to raise another question that is curiously absent from this discussion.
Is there is an issue of racism in ME dance? I know where I am from, it is believed among some people that there is a certain look one must have in order to belly dance and this look is east indian, or syian/lebanese....long hair, straight nose and fair skin. This is probably because this is the general image of belly dance that has been in the media.

as an anecdote: While my teacher was in trinidad, she used to make it a point to stress that the belly dance that she taught was from "Egypt, which is in Africa", apparently because there were students of east indian descent in the class who were not really appreciative of the fact that she being Argentinian was married to a black man from Haiti..(a few students left her class because of it apparently)

Anyway I am wondering if this is an isolated phenomenon, because having looked at many videos there is an overwhelming majority of dances who do not have african features, is there any particular reason why more black women have not been involved in the dance? is it that they are more underground? is it that mainstream ME dance society has not been able to attract more to the dance?

not wanting to raise a can of worms but if that is the case so be it.