Bullsh*t Radar Overload!

[Suheir]

I've just read the following on the website of a UK teacher I hadn't come across before. Please ensure that there are no heavy objects nor hot drinks to hand when reading this:

" Belly dance, also known as Raks Sharki, Baladi, is believed to be as old, or older than the 14th century. Performed all over the world, this dance is increasing in it’s popularity. It is more of an evocative than a provocative dance and is the only dance where the ladies traditionally get paid to dance whilst keeping all their clothes on!!!



It is said that poor ladies in Greece would tie a scarf around their waist and go into the market place and ‘dance for their dowry’s’(coins). They would sew the coins they received to their scarves and bodices for decoration as they had no where safer to keep them, hence the coin hip scarves that we wear today.



The beauty of this dance is that it was created for women by women, The movements complement the female form and does wonders both internally and externally for the beautiful goddesses women are!



The Arab women teach this form of dance to their daughters form an early age to help prepare and strengthen the female reproduction organs during the developing cycles of puberty as well as conception, pregnancy, birth, labour and and menopause. "

 

[maylynn]

i think someone needs to do a bit more research if she wants to be taken seriously.

 

[Maria_Aya]

It is said that poor ladies in Greece would tie a scarf around their waist and go into the market place and ‘dance for their dowry’s’(coins). They would sew the coins they received to their scarves and bodices for decoration as they had no where safer to keep them, hence the coin hip scarves that we wear today.

"

Oh my !!! when I was a poor and innocent girl (and keeping all my clothes on!!) was walking in the markets of Athens just dancing for coins....
Now that I'm rich, bitch and ofcourse strip when I dance (Kitchen baladi throwing my gloves away !!! youtube evidence lol) I just cant stand these stupidities !!! but again... we have to remember how we started lol


Maria Aya Athens (at Greece lol)

 

[PriscillaAdum]

Hmmm. I can think of alot safer ways to store coins than to sew them on a scarf or bodice where they might fall off. It's such an ilogical thing to do. Did they drill holes in the coins as well? That's a whole lotta hand drilling if they planned on having enough coins for a decent dowry.
I find it terribly annoying when someone writes an article about bellydance and uses the phrase "It is said that....." as if that gave more credibility to whatever affirmation they are making. It's so vague, and you don't really know who said it. Was it said by someone who is an authority on the origins of dance? Or was it the mailman who said it?

Regards
Priscila

 

[Shanazel]

Ah, Maria, you are the Gypsy Rose Lee of the kitchen baladi, especially when it comes to discarding gloves.

Everything she says is absolutely TRUE. How can you disbelieve? I have been dancing at least since the fifteenth century ( I was invited to perform at the celebration following lifting the siege of Orleans) and I clearly recall an older dancer telling me that her mother the Priestess of the Goddess of Swing taught her to do body rolls to assist in child birth- so there. Hmmph.

 

[Aniseteph]

The Arab women teach this form of dance to their daughters form an early age to help prepare and strengthen the female reproduction organs...

Ms A of Sussex writes: Before I discovered belly dance I was a feeble apology for a woman, but now... Ovaries of Steel! Grrrrrr! (flexes in a Popeye style)

 

[Kharis]

I've just read the following on the website of a UK teacher I hadn't come across before. Please ensure that there are no heavy objects nor hot drinks to hand when reading this:

" Belly dance, also known as Raks Sharki, Baladi, is believed to be as old, or older than the 14th century. Performed all over the world, this dance is increasing in it’s popularity. It is more of an evocative than a provocative dance and is the only dance where the ladies traditionally get paid to dance whilst keeping all their clothes on!!!



It is said that poor ladies in Greece would tie a scarf around their waist and go into the market place and ‘dance for their dowry’s’(coins). They would sew the coins they received to their scarves and bodices for decoration as they had no where safer to keep them, hence the coin hip scarves that we wear today.



The beauty of this dance is that it was created for women by women, The movements complement the female form and does wonders both internally and externally for the beautiful goddesses women are!



The Arab women teach this form of dance to their daughters form an early age to help prepare and strengthen the female reproduction organs during the developing cycles of puberty as well as conception, pregnancy, birth, labour and and menopause. "

And the website address is......?

 

[Suheir]

And the website address is......?

Melina.Zari - Middle Eastern Dance Group 

 

[Brea]

...

 

[Kharmine]

Years ago when I was active in putting on Renaissance fairs, we organizers sometimes came up with fantasy explanations for things that most definitely were not historically accurate but were too popular to exclude from the entertainment.

"The belly dancers? Uh, King Richard I brought a troupe back to England from the Crusades, and they've been touring ever since! Yeah, that's it!" Or in Renfair speak: "Verily, that be the right of it!" We thought intelligent people would know this was a tongue-in-cheek assertion.

But the next thing we knew, people were telling each other this silly fable as if it were a fact, especially the belly dancers, who would embroider this assertion shamelessly and adamantly. The fact that these dancers often did not bother to dress in anything like the 17th-century period shoulda been a clue but it wasn't.

What we thought was a harmless practice of stretching the truth for entertainment's sake resulted in activities that have helped dilute the value of Renfairs by continuously lowering the standards for historical accuracy. It's hard to find a "Renfair" today that isn't more fantasy than fact.

I blame people's willingness to believe almost anything on the way they are taught in school. First, there's not enough effort paid to getting people to think critically and logically. :think:

Then, history is interesting but taught in such a bland, lifeless, narrow way that it seems like only the boring stuff is considered important. People tune out what doesn't seem relevant or intriguing. They also forget a lot of what they did learn.

True, history is not always chronicled accurately and truthfully but some people think that because of that nothing can be assumed to be true except what appeals to them on an emotional level.

Frauds, charlatans and politicians then seize on that assumption and stoke it because they have their own agendas for getting people to believe what they want them to believe.


In the end, though, responsibility still rests with us. We all know we're supposed to be more skeptical and look for proper evidence, but we don't always try -- either 'cause we don't know how and/or it looks too hard to be worth the effort.

As a result, we don't always challenge hearsay. We prefer to think others have already done the heavy lifting and then whatever we hear from other people we like -- or who are posing as experts -- is acceptable "evidence" on the face of it.

Here's a clue, folks: If the person making certain assertions cannot give you reasonable access to his/her sources for his/her claims (names, dates, contact info, citations from reputable publications/interviews/documentaries, book titles, studies, etc.), then it is unlikely they are voicing anything but their opinions.

The more unusual their assertions (they can't cite anyone or anything that would back up their claims that anyone else can verify) and the more they insist that all the time-tested standards of evidence are unnecessary or so flawed as to be untrustworthy, the more suspicious you should be.

We can't forget this. We need to keep reminding others of it, too. Those who would claim it's unnecessary or somehow "biased" (when applied to them) are hoping to remain unchallenged for completely selfish reasons of their own.

Allowing fantasy to pass as facts, and giving others a "pass" to do so for whatever reason, can result in losing more than we ever imagined. Don't be part of the problem, folks -- a they say in smart Wiccan circles: FIGHT THE FLUFFBUNNY!!!

Ya wanna make a difference, ladies 'n' gents? Then email this erring sister and politely ask about her sources for her assertions. Nicely, let her know where you have found more reputable evidence, or where your own experience contradicts her claims. Remind her that historical accuracy is something we all need to protect and promote to foster understanding and respect for our art.

By doing so, you give her a chance to set the record straight. If she responds with self-serving crap, publish it here. Sooner or later, she'll get the message: You can't fool all of the people all of the time.

Whew! sorry for gabbling, people! Time for me to go back to scribblin' for a livin' and leave y'all to talk about this amongst yerselves!

 

[Shanazel]

Super Journalist strikes yet another blow for Right, Good Research, and the Illuminated Path! Yay, Kharmine!

I have great resources to back up my contentions- primary sources from the 15th century written by me! I'd show them to you, but they are, er, at the cleaners right now.

 

[Caroline_afifi]

I dont know the woman in question here, but she maybe a really nice woman who is only repeating what she has been told.
Ok, not a good idea but perhaps she will be mortified when she realises and change it all.

It is when people dont do this, stick to what they are saying, make up lies to and twist the truth in order to better themselves that there should be a big issue and we should all stand against it. Dont you think? :think:

 

[Moon]

i think someone needs to do a bit more research if she wants to be taken seriously.

Lets hope so. I have to admit.... If I had read this at a younger age and before I started dancing myself, I would have believed quite a lot of it . I can imagine I'm not the only one.

 

[adiemus]

'ovaries of steel' - HAH!!!! luvvit.
Wish I'd known about bellydance when I gave birth to my two kids, would never have needed my epidural, could have just thought it was just a big pumpkin, done a bodywave or two and popped 'em right out and gone back to figure eights and snake arms. Instead I think I remember squawking something about two minutes of pleasure and now THIS?!!

 

[Pia]

You assumed people would get tounge in cheek on a reenactment?! am afraid most poeple seem to be willing to belive ANYTHING if its said in olde english.

It would be interesting to see where this information had come from and if anyone is willing to name a source for these belly dance urban myths

 

[Reen.Blom]

Well its not like there is a course "origin of belly dance".... try google it... LOL with so much false info how can one find right info? After all most dont bother to research and look for proof of evidence....

 

[Suheir]

The reaction on a prominent burlesque internet message board to Miles Copeland's recent gildedserpent.com article about belly dance being confused with burlesque was predictable, but how about this particular response from a burlesque fan:

"Not to revisit an old chaper, especially about a fool who, well needs to pick up a history book.
I had to chuckle to myself. For my dissertation I wrote about the the history of striptease and Burlesque, The first thing I discovered was that Belly dancing is the ancient beginnings of striptease. dating back to ancient egypt.

The end"

 

[Aniseteph]

oh well, if we are historically joined at the hip that's all just fine then.... NOT. (IMHO)

Do not get me started on the burly/belly thing... I'm hoping if I leave it a while I might avoid going into uncontrollable vent mode.

 

[Caroline_afifi]

I had to chuckle to myself. For my dissertation I wrote about the the history of striptease and Burlesque, The first thing I discovered was that Belly dancing is the ancient beginnings of striptease. dating back to ancient egypt.

The end"

Did you read the book 'Stripping in Time?'

There is a whole chapter dedicated to Egyptian dance.

 

[Suheir]

Did you read the book 'Stripping in Time?'

There is a whole chapter dedicated to Egyptian dance.

Oh, ho! You think that's where this person got it from?